Have Poles blood on their hands? :)

If it makes you feel better - Prussia was a paradise compared with the opression in the Russian partition.

Doesn't prove that Poles in general were not allowed to own the houses they were already living in. Being banned to build a new home is a different story.

Not for their children, and their children's children who had to move SOMEWHERE. But yes, I don't want to offend anybody (I have German ancestry and part of my family moved back to Germany during communism, so really, no hard feelings) so let me clarify - the situation was far from desparate, nevertheless it caused a lot of bitterness. Jews were not treated as harshly and such was the birth of the saying about the ownership of streets an houses.

Don't worry - we are talking about something that happened over a hundred years ago. It's of historical interest, but that's about it.

I'm of Polish/German descent as well BTW, and I happen to have an original land record/ deed of my great-grandfather at home. He was Polish and bought a piece of land AND a house in the Poznan area in 1910. That's one reason why I kept insisting.

Eh, I wouldn't call myself of German descent, the situation was a bit... complicated (the grandmother of my grandmother was a GERMAN from LATVIA, she married a POLE from BELARUS and settled in RUSSIAN Poland. During war my great-grandparents and their siblings had the chance of registering themselves as Germans but they turned it down - they felt Polish. Only they stopped feeling Polish after the first few years of communist rule and decided that they're better off as Germans, aquired German citizenship and moved to West Germany. My grandparents had a looong talk over whether to do the same but in the end decided to stay)

so it is true that the poles like to throw a rock and hide their hands?
Poles killed 1,600 Jews in the north-eastern village of Jedwabne in 1941a and all the massacres had previously been blamed on Nazi troops

There are documented cases of 769 polish villages massacred by the nazis (I know of at least three massacred as a punishment for hiding Jews - possibly more, I would have to find the page) and identified 1500 places of mass killing of Poles by UPA, there were polish villages massacred by Lithuanians, Belarussians, Soviets and Soviet-allied Jews (though not many). Would you like to discuss it?

Well even if Jedwabne is true I hardly accept it as any Ak operation nor Polish people doing or anything. I would more say that it was Jedwabne locals who did it, right? If it was like 10k more stories in different places then that's a different sotry but their not?

don bullshi* me :) For decades, Polish communist authorities covered up the role of Poles in the Jedwabne massacre, blaming Nazi killing squads for the murders.

Here we go again...


I think poland (kwasiewski) has already accepted responsibility and apologised for this crime.

Also, keep in mind that jews sided with the russians in 1919-21 and helped the ruskies identify scores of polish intelligensia so they could put a bullet in the back of their heads! What goes around comes around. I don't condone this, but this is the way the cookie crumbles.


Jews also liked doing BBQs! Unfortunately there were some participants in the holocaust in all parts of german occupied europe, even jews themselves!

Here is a book Pole-bashers should read. It's written by a Jew who talks about how the Jews re-started the concentration camps after poland's 'liberation' by the russians.




I'm pretty sure every nation has blood at its hands, including your beloved Espana.

Hmm....

What about Września case where Polish kids were beaten by sadistic German teachers???? It was an outrageous act of brutal violence.

Prussia tried to implement german as main lingua between all the minorities now living between prussian/german borders.
Like english in the US.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germanisation#In_Prussia

Do you know that german children were beaten by their prussian teachers too?
The "Prügelstrafe" was a common element in german school till even after the war.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_Germany#Life_in_a_German_school


Mean? Surely! "Sadistic"? Hardly..



Oh please!

Pawian, tell me...is the long tolerance of the polish language by Prussia also mentioned in Poland or only the tries by the gov to give the country a main language?

Tolerates Poland another school language than polish?

Let's see how "nice" Poland handled a similiar situation compared to "brutal" Germany:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polonization#Second_Polish_Republic






Wait....forced polish teaching in ukrainian schools???
A "land reform" favouring Poles to the native Ukrainians???

Interesting, isn't it...




Now compare that to Prussia...
During all the partitions around 500,000 Poles came to work and to live either in Prussia or in the Ruhr. Many stayed for good and assimilated, the rest makes the biggest Polonia in Europe.

On the other hand today barely any Germans live anymore in what is now Poland.

Sometimes a good long look into a mirror would be advisable for some Poles...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Ukrainian_minority_in_Poland


Now many "filozofs" tell me that they brought "culture" and "education" to Ukraine whereas in 17th century there was much more schools in Ukraine than either in countries with such cities as Maskau and Krakau. Two greatest "educators" - Polish and Russians completely destroyed universities and schools that existed for hundreds of years.


Here I am simply speechless.


Quite a knowledge-thirsty youth you had back then.


As was quoted above Frederik William lll said:" Your religion will be upheld". Not with Polish "Christian" policies.


Exactly famous Polish expression in action: "Waszy ulicy, naszy kamianicy" said in regards to Jews, but implemented by Poles towards Ukrainians with the covered double-facedness.

genforum.genealogy.com/ukraine/messages/4892.html


How did Germans dare to BUY OUT Polish houses? They even PAID for them! Shame on Germans. In Ukraine Polish PAYMENT was in different currency, not in zloty even.

After all that and much more, there are slobbering tears about UPA (Ukrainian Insurgent Army) and their fight for my country's independance.


For some? Sometimes? Mirror should be permanently attached to the forehead and removed right before putting into the coffin, because disease is incurable as I noticed on many other forums and only grave will solve the issue.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organization_of_Ukrainian_Nationalists#Background_and_Creation

"In contrast, the OUN accepted violence as a political tool against foreign and domestic enemies of their cause. Most of its activity was directed against Polish politicians and government representatives. Under the command of the Western Ukrainian Territorial Executive (established February 1929), the OUN carried out hundreds of acts of sabotage in Galicia and Volhynia, including a campaign of arson against Polish landowners (which helped provoke the 1930 Pacification), boycotts of state schools and Polish tobacco and liquor monopolies, dozens of expropriation attacks on government institutions to obtain funds for its activities, and some sixty assassinations."

I can't seem to recall Poles doing the same to Prussians, although who knows? The opression of Ukrainians is certainly despicable, but you actively fuelled the hate. Poland back then was a nationalist country, constantly threatened by the Soviet Union with which there was quite a big war for several years. Furthermore there was a a lot of fighting between the government parties as well. The country was on a verge of collapsing and so the problems with Ukrainians occured an the most unfavourable moment. Perhaps a dialog would have helped you more.

And by the way -


I wonder how the mass murder of Polish population helped you against German occupation? As I recall the Germans ruled in Volhynia even after all poles from there died or run away.

And these days Poles get their own back by not allowing foreigners to even own the land of their choice, let alone build a house on it!


I think that the Ukrainians probably remember the Polish-Soviet war, what with them having fought on the same side as Poland and then having been stabbed in the back by their Polish allies.

If that was an act of stabbing in the back, then I guess you finally admit that Great Britain stabbed Poland in the back in 1945?

You show me the part of the treaty obligation which Britain did not keep to the letter and I will most certainly admit that.

Can't see blood on anyone's hands because of this, it's irrelevant to the topic. You haven't given any links or sources - therefore it's drivel.

As for all the talk about minorities, Ukrainians lead by OUN-B, commited a genocide on Polish minorities in Wolyn in 1943 just to win any upcoming elections. There's still a lot of hatred in both polish and ukrainian people living near ukrainian-polish border.

BB I really don't understand where do you find the nerve to state your cheeky comments excusing prussian annexation and telling us how it wasn't as bad "because", which German deeds will you start to justify next?

Well...if you would be so kind to read the quotes and links you would see that it isn't only me being "cheeky" but the judgement of history and facts.

It's interesting to pull your polish myths apart one by one.
You are obviously brought up on falsifications, propaganda or at least on a VERY one sided view of polish history (in short: Poles fantastic - Germans beasts/Ukrainians some kind of subhumans/Brits traitors etc.).

It's wrong!

Very true when referring to ww2 events.
Nonsense as some generalization.

I just love the way that Poles whine about not being allowed to build houses in foreign countries a hundred years ago but today won't let foreigners even buy land unless they get a permit (which at least one of the ministries involved often refuses to issue).

Similiar to the Poles getting screwed when they saddled up with the separatist Ukrainians in an effort liberate both their lands from imperial rule.

How? The Ukrainian nationalists sign a seperate peace with the Central Powers through as part of the Brest-Litovsk treaty.

no blood, lay :)

Care to name the treaty which both sides signed?


Er, Poland was on the same side as the Central Powers.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treaty_of_Brest-Litovsk

"In Poland, which was not mentioned in the treaty, its signing caused riots and protests, and the final withdrawal of any support for the Central Powers."

I bet someone will now digg up a an earlier betrayal by Poland. I have a strange feeling that if we continue this long enough, we will have to go through the whole millenium. I miss the times when countries were proud of their conquests.

Where does it say i don't believe you? I simply put up a link regarding gas vans/trucks in answer to your post (4)

I can now see you were just being a sarcastic arsehole.

Do you not understand what that says? Babinich is claiming that the Ukrainians betrayed Poland by signing a seperate peace treaty (part of Brest-Litovsk) with the Central Powers and your quote says that the treaty caused the final withdrawal of any support for the Central Powers.

How that means that the Ukrainians were fighting alongside Poland against the Central Powers I have no idea!

but why fight?
why busy on blood?
donate blood :) Red Cross/Crecent :)

Harry - To tell you the truth I have no idea what was the conflict about, I just did a little wiki-fu. You said Poland was supporting the Central Powers and I was refering to that. You made it sound as if Poland was satisfied with the treaty.

adibjaber - can an allergic person donate blood? Or organs for that matter? Because I was hoping I could give my organs after my death, so I won't wake up inside the coffin or something.

no please no blood of elergy


you are polishwoman?