Life in Partitioned Poland (Specifically in the Prussian Partition)

Still, he was dismissed from the last class (klasa maturalna) at school for negative comments about Bismarck and in 1902 he was in jail for the articles he wrote: "To Germans" and "To my brothers, Upper Silesians" :)

Sorry man, it's always like that here... I hope you got enough from those less strictly led by their demons.

Oh cry me a river...the polish president Mazowiecky was the first one after the war to acknowledge the presence of some Germans left in Poland at all, in 1989!

How is that for Polonization or denying the existence of the heart and soul of a whole minority at all...you can't even hold a candle on Prussia!

Hey, it's okay... I like to see people having fun :-) You are all having fun right....?

It's all been helpful so far. I'm learning a lot, so that can only be a good thing.

Before 1989 the presence of some Poles was not fully acknowledged either. Nor the absence of quite a lot of them.

Edit:

I strongly protest! That was in the spirit of mutual understanding and filling up the trenches between the nations! I will complain to Strasbourg! MODS ARE FASCISTS!!!

See you in three days, guys...

Oh, I don't know, nott. I've seen it before with Russians, I've discussed with some who were so nice, funny, fluffy and all, and so nice to me, but after a while I got to know their views and it gave me shivers.


Indeed.

There's been an old joke in the USA...."Who's buried in Grant's tomb?" At least we know someone is buried there.

With all the atrocites that took place throughout Europe, before, during and after WWII, the question/joke in Europe could be "Who's buried in your back yard?"

You'll see.

May as well face it. You have a few Germanized Poles looking for where there families came from. And trying to learn why the world booted them from lands.

is great ! you should go there !

It looks like I've seen quite enough already...

Cinnabar, another link for you:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Eastern_Marches_Society

Btw, why are you interested particularly in the Prussian partition?

Thanks for the additional link, will read it later when I get a moment.

I'm actually trying to do some research for a novel I'm writing. The novel will follow one Polish family all the way from the eighteenth century up to the 1950s (and potentially beyond, though I think not). This is probably a very foolish thing to do for a man who has no real connection with Poland, but I've found the country very interesting, and want to turn that interest into something a bit more substantial. Would appreciate all the help I can get. My queries are not restricted to the Prussian Partition, they go all over the place!

Sometimes I feel it might actually be insulting for a foreigner like me to try and write about the intricacies of Polish history. In more 'challenging' moments I start thinking that I don't have the scope of knowledge, or the feeling for the Polish people, that it requires. But still, it might throw up some intriguing results. What do you think about the moral aspects of taking on another country's history? Be interested to know. I'd like to do the subject justice.

Interesting Idea. Good Luck with it.

Well...better don't start as it will be a flop.
Writing ones own history is a daunting task already but writing about a foreign country's history without having even basic knowledge is madness. Nothing good can come out of it.

Learn at least the language so that you can read from time witnesses, better yet learn both languages so that you can read from all concerned parties, settle there or live there for longer amount of time...walk the old towns, go the old ways...to make your story somehow believable you must yourself immerse into this region, into this culture....not asking some questions on an internet forum!

Seriously...

PS: There are some archives there already, even online but mostly in other books in polish and german, where polish and german families tell their stories...you will need to know the languages when you want to know what you will be writing about.

This boarder has moved so many times no one knows who's polish or whos german.
There is no way to tell what they felt like in 1800 unless you find a diary of day to day life.

That too...

Oh... Hmm... Then I guess a lot of reading awaits you ;)


Well... I don't think it will be insulting if your aim isn't to insult... But I think a difficult task is ahead of you if you want to portray life at those times in a realistic way and give it some depth. I think besides reading historical books and memoirs on the subject you could read some of the Polish novels to get a feel of those times. I've mentioned "Ziemia obiecana" already:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Promised_Land_%28novel%29
And a film:
imdb.com/title/tt0072446
I remember that when I was at school I read a novel about how life for school children looked like during the partitions, but I don't remember the title right now.

There's also "Nad Niemnem" by Eliza Orzeszkowa (boring as hell, but it could be useful for you).
Also this book could be useful, I guess:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Doll_%28novel%29

When I think of other books I'll let you know.
But I'm afraid without the knowledge of Polish you will have to rely on probably very scarce sources in English. I doubt that, for example, any memoirs would be published in English, but who knows...


Then if you want to get to know points of view of all the sides you would have to probably learn at least three languages: Polish, German and Russian ;)

Anyway, the idea itself is interesting but if you're thinking about it seriously then the workload will be huge, so good luck :)

Oh, and there's another Polish literature classic "Noce i dnie" ("Nights and Days") by Maria Dąbrowska, I think it can be very useful to you. It's a family saga about two generations of Polish noble family. There was an Oscar nominated film:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nights_and_Days
and TV series on Polish TV.
The main music theme is quite well known in Poland:

You can watch the film on Youtube (it's in 13 parts, I think), but without English subtitles, unfortunately:
...

Btw, the film "The Promised Land" by Andrzej Wajda was also Oscar nominated so I guess it's worth watching.


So there's going to be also the World War II period and some of the communist times... oh my...
;)

Thanks for all the responses. It's great to get people's opinions on what I'm doing.

I've spent a lot of time thinking about whether it is a good idea to continue with this idea. I've decided that it is, because I think that I can write something that will be interesting and compelling. Elements of the story also take place in England, so I'm not totally out of my comfort zone, just significantly uncomfortable I guess.

There's no point in me being unrealistic about my shortcomings. There are going to be massive gaps in my understanding, and somebody from Poland will probably be able to pick the final product apart. But all historical fiction has its weaknesses. This will be my interpretation. It can't be real, it can only be fiction. That is a blessing and a curse.

I understand that it will take a lot of hard work, I've put quite a lot of work into it already. I was in Poland for a week in March just trying to get a feel for the place and walking around some of the areas which I intend to feature in the book. It all helped a lot, but I'd like to get away for longer (work always gets in the way).

Language is the biggest barrier. I'd happily learn Polish, but it will take me some time to get up to the point where I'll be able to read Polish texts. This, obviously, means that I am greatly limited in terms of what has been translated. I know how little there is out there (believe me I've looked).

Paulina, keep sending over the book and film ideas, they're invaluable.


I've seen a number of Andrzej Wajda films (Ashes and Diamonds, Kanal, Man of Iron [can't find a copy of Man of Marble], A Generation, Katyń), but so much is left without a subtitled release for general distribution.

I've read 'The Doll' by Prus, good read if somewhat overburdened in areas, but that's realism for you. I try and work my way through Miłosz's History of Polish literature, digging out what I can find from libraries. It's slim pickings. I haven't managed to find any of the books you've mentioned so far, but will keep looking.


Yep, it's a lot to take on. The first generations are basically scanned through. They set the scene for the real heart of the story which stretches from the end of the first world war to the mid fifties. It's doable. Trust me :-)


Thank you


Maybe, but sometimes you can't choose your inspirations. You just have to go with it, even if it's the literary equivalent of putting your head in a blender. :-)

OK, I'll try :)

The details you are looking for may be living right there in London with you, but you may have to hurry. Interviews with older Poles may be the quickest and best resource you have. Speaking to those who lived what you want to record could be cathartic for everyone involved; it will give those a chance to tell their story one more time and you will experience their emotions first hand.

If only I could speak to my father one more time. The questions I would ask.

I don't think he is talking about German Silesians.

Rather, I think he means "Silesian Silesians," or "autochthons" as the Polish government labelled them.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silesians

Read Andrew Tarnowski's The Last Mazurka-it could be just what you are looking for, it touches on the cultural aspects of things and focuses on the tribulations of a Polish Family pre-war and after.

Good suggestion, have ordered a copy. Could point me in the right directions.

Another book that i would recommend, is Poland by James A. Michener. He follows the life of Polish families throughout and not only the upper strata of society. Even though his knowledge of Poland was quite limited probably more limited than yourself, he produced a very credible piece of work-it fact it was a bestseller.

He did visit the country for a short period though.

Never herard of the Hakata? Or Drzymała's wagon? Back to school for you.

Both spled blood in the name of something which didn't help our both nations :/
Aaargh if not thoose National-Democrats :(
Should have listened to wise Piłsudski!!!

Life in Partitioned Poland (Specifically in the Prussian Partition)
In general every time it was an uprising all three partitioneers got together to wipe off all insurgents, no chance in hell to win against 3 major powers in Europe at the same bloody time!!!

Also ive heard about Poles being billed, in Prussia there was a lot of bills about everything right? BB was it with all Prussians citizens or just Poles mainly?

All citizens had to obey to the same laws...Prussia was a quite liberal hodgepodge for it's time.
That's why Poles had their papers, had their places in the parliament, could vote, could demonstrate, could grow an influential middle class...like any other Prussian citizen too.

So there was a lot of bills like if the colours on the fence weren't right they had to pay a bill etc...
Poor poor citizens of Prussia :/
(Reminds me of the place in Drammen-Norway I can't have my dog there!!!)
(alot of swear words which are commented but not described)

Why poor? They lived in the most advanced country in Europe of that time...Best education, best infrastructure, great industrial development...Prussia proper shoving alot of money and

investments eastwards (alot like today actually).

Poles just love to bathe in victimhood....nothing much changed actually...

I didn't mean poor in the sense of wealth I meant in the sense of life in general!
I would never live in a country with a lot of laws which limits my freedom for the sake of quiet or peacefull neighbours baargh