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POLAND: EASTERN or CENTRAL European country?


Basil 1 | 8
26 May 2010 #391
Ok, so it seems that for Western majority here the Eastern Europe has been defined during Cold War. (Eastern Bloc - essentially non Russian Warsaw Pact members)

My beef with it is that used nowadays it frequently is a vague reference to that past and conveys the ignorance about current state of affairs in Europe. It's became essentially meaningless now (it defines different area depending on who is defining it)

So is Poland in Eastern Europe geographically? Nope.
Geographical midpoint of Europe:

Slavic countries: Nope (Estonia, Latvia, Romania, Hungary anyone?)

Political divisions: Nope (see EU border, enlargement steps)

Does it include Russia? (it does for some: us.ishares.com/product_info/fund/overview/ESR.htm)

Just see Wikipedia article on Eastern Europe and check how many times political division between "East" and "West" shifted over current Polish territory.

Given all that confusion as a Pole I would prefer Poland to be referred as located in Central Europe.
It is a geographical term not burdened by all the political past and a nice starting point to further define what we are talking about.

I do not have much hope for that happening soon though :-)

It is funny to see sometimes the media being confused about it :

businessweek.com/news/2010-05-25/euro-lost-allure-for-eastern-nations-with-free-floats-ing-says.html

May 25 (Bloomberg) -- The euro has lost its allure for nations in central and Eastern Europe with floating currencies as their borrowing costs fell below those in some euro region states because of the Greek crisis, said ING Groep NV.

"central and Eastern Europe"? Why lo-cap, man?

Cyprus is a part of Eastern Europe acc. to Morgan Stanley :-)

quicktake.morningstar.com/cefnet/Holdings.aspx?Country=USA&Symbol=RNE

Concluding:

"Poland is in Eastern Europe."
What do you mean?
zetigrek
26 May 2010 #392
In polish media one dont find any reference that poland is easter-european country. If I read in western newspapers that poland is east europe then it comes to my mind journalist's lack of competence
Seanus 15 | 19,706
26 May 2010 #393
Are you suggesting that Poland isolate itself, Ironside? Only the views of Poles matter, is that what you are saying? So, inward investment is ok to prop up Polish business but any other input isn't?

The fact is, Ironside, most Poles don't have a clue what the Polish voice really is. Rather ironic! I've asked many times and not one Pole could give me a satisfactory answer. Time to look within again, methinks.
jwojcie 2 | 763
26 May 2010 #394
As Mao would put it: Poland lies on this small Asian peninsula called Europe :-)
From that perspective eastern or central is a smaller issue :-)
Sokrates 8 | 3,346
26 May 2010 #395
The fact is, Ironside, most Poles don't have a clue what the Polish voice really is. Rather ironic! I've asked many times and not one Pole could give me a satisfactory answer. Time to look within again, methinks.

Thats the problem of you not being Polish Sean, God knows i hate to point it out since if there's ever been people i was all for letting in its people like you.

Just because 2 Poles have 4 opinions on 1 subject doesnt mean there's no common ground, see Pope and Presidents deaths for example, its a bit esoteric in nature and often eludes non-Poles.
Seanus 15 | 19,706
26 May 2010 #396
I only said it based on the lack of cogent replies I got from many Poles. They are generally happy to put food on the table and be with their families.

As for Poland's position on the international stage, it's far from clear at times.
TheOther 5 | 3,758
26 May 2010 #397
If I read in western newspapers that poland is east europe then it comes to my mind journalist's lack of competence

Maybe the Polish journalists lack competence? I would say, Poland is definitely western ... western Siberia ... :)

Who cares whether Poland is an eastern or central European country?
zetigrek
26 May 2010 #398
western Siberia

Is there in Siberia 31 celcius degrees in summer? Well...

Who cares whether Poland is an eastern or central European country?

I care. And whats more I feel deep compulsion to educate the other(s) ;)
Ironside 50 | 10,939
26 May 2010 #399
Are you suggesting that Poland isolate itself, Ironside?

nope, I think academical question which is Poland in the eyes of the west will be even more devoid of meaning if Poland will not shake off bastards claiming to be Polish elite.

To be or not to be for Poland not as colony but independent entity is on stake and believe me Seanus western views on Poland are secondary issues. Which could be deal with in due time. Strong and successful state has many friends.

Only the views of Poles matter, is that what you are saying?

Well, yes!

o, inward investment is ok to prop up Polish business but any other input isn't?

well, that is an specific question it all depends on circumstances....

The fact is, Ironside, most Poles don't have a clue what the Polish voice really is.

I know! I tell you more Poles are divided and that division is real, different values and views on a many subjects!
There is hidden conflict and people are confused because they don't understand what that conflict is about. I would say that is a conflict of civilizations and I don't mean term "civilization" in the light of Arnold Toynbee's.

I may add that material situation of general Polish population, doesn't encourage people to participate actively in politics.
Mr Grunwald 29 | 2,014
27 May 2010 #400
Who cares whether Poland is an eastern or central European country?

It's about Poland reputation here hello?!
Crow 146 | 9,112
27 May 2010 #401
POLAND: EASTERN or CENTRAL European country?

for me, Poland is the West. The very core

that what is so called west (western parts of Europe and USA) are Africa to me. Not only for me, of course
POLENGGGs 2 | 150
29 May 2010 #402
True true. we have the forests in the east, can always retreat there and no 1 will find us.
But I would consider the area roughly former Yugoslavia the centre of the world. That place is sacred, especially Kosovo - too bad I can't do nothing what happening in Kosovo but still.

as to the original question; Poland=Eastern Europe
vetala - | 382
9 Jun 2010 #404
Like every Pole, I used to be bothered by the "Eastern" label but now I actually quite like it. Eastern cultures are much more interesting and diverse than Western ones. It doesn't change the fact that we're in the geographical center of Europe, though.
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,632
9 Jun 2010 #405
Eastern cultures are much more interesting and diverse than Western ones.

How so?
southern 75 | 7,096
9 Jun 2010 #406
Eastern Europe sounds mysterious.
vetala - | 382
9 Jun 2010 #407
How so?

I meant it more in the way of the Western/Eastern world than just Europe. When you hear "West" what comes to your mind? America, France, England... not much of a difference. But when you hear "East" it could be Russia, Persia or even China and Japan - so very different. Of course, Poland is culturally hard to distinguish from Western European countries but being listed alongside diverse Eastern cultures is an honor.
Bratwurst Boy 9 | 10,632
9 Jun 2010 #408
Hmmm....let's see what Wiki says:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_world

From a cultural and sociological approach the Western world is defined as including all cultures that are directly derived from European cultures, i.e. Europe, the Americas (North and South America), Israel, Australia and New Zealand. Together these countries constitute Western society[19][20][21]

All the same huh?
DomPolski 7 | 33
9 Jun 2010 #409
I meant it more in the way of the Western/Eastern world than just Europe. When you hear "West" what comes to your mind? America, France, England... not much of a difference. But when you hear "East" it could be Russia, Persia or even China and Japan - so very different. Of course, Poland is culturally hard to distinguish from Western European countries but being listed alongside diverse Eastern cultures is an honor.

What are you talking about? We are slavs. We are eastern peoples. You're saying we are closer to the french than the russians? I think the term eastern europe should encompass all countries in the warsaw pact even if some are in European union.
vetala - | 382
9 Jun 2010 #410
All the same huh?

I was talking about general perceptions people have not the exact encyclopedic definition, which by the way changes a lot with time as you may have noticed. And if you care more about encyclopedic definitions, then you have to agree that Poland is in the center of Europe, neither in the West nor in the East.
southern 75 | 7,096
9 Jun 2010 #411
But when you hear "East" it could be Russia, Persia or even China and Japan - so very different. Of course, Poland is culturally

When we talk about East we don't really mean that Poles believe in Buddha.
vetala - | 382
9 Jun 2010 #412
Pride by association, man.
nomaderol 5 | 726
10 Jun 2010 #413
To my observation, nowadays, Poland is one of two centers of the world now.
southern 75 | 7,096
10 Jun 2010 #414
And the other center is Turkey?
nomaderol 5 | 726
10 Jun 2010 #415
The other center is mobile. Nowadays, whole world focused on Israel. So, maybe, it is Israel now.
rychlik 41 | 373
3 Nov 2010 #416
Merged thread:
POLES BUNCHED TOGETHER AS "EASTERN EUROPEANS"

Why are Poles bunched in together as Eastern Europeans and Russians usually get their own category? When they show a demographic census in Canada for example you see "Russian and/or Eastern European". Historically and statistically there have always been more Poles in Canada than Russians. Poles and Ukrainians are the two biggest Eastern European groups. Are Russians more important? Eastern Europeans are all not the same!
convex 20 | 3,978
3 Nov 2010 #417
Because Canadian census takers don't consider people born in Vladivostok as Eastern Europeans?
Mr Grunwald 29 | 2,014
3 Nov 2010 #418
Poles in general have been historically central-eastern Europeans but now we can only say Central Europeans (if we want to be correct)
It makes me sooo angry when Norwegian papers say that Poles are from "Øst-Europa" (East-Europe) because the reason they say it is they always said "Østblokken" (Eastern block)

Their so fricking laaaazy!! It annoys me like hell!!!!
1jola 14 | 1,879
3 Nov 2010 #419
They are being polite and don't want to throw us in the same bag with the Russians.


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