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Lusatian-Sarmatic obsession of Poles

Crow 150 | 9,537
25 Jul 2017 #91
"Serb" most probably meant 'kinsman' in proto-Slavic.

Most probable `Serb` coming from the word (verb) such is `to collect` (in Serbian- `sakupljati`, `sabirati`). In Ukrainian language its `zbirati` [what because of that `z` reminds me of Russian Empress Catharine the Great who was of Lusatian Serbian origin, originally was Princess of Anhalt-Zerbst]. Then also in Polish `zbierać`. In Russian `sobirat`. In Czech `sbirat`. Etc. Lingustic stance is that speaking about meaning of Serbian ethnic name ultimately we coming to the `great mass of people` that was comprehend as one, united, around something. Explanations goes from things such are `united effort in collecting the food` to the `unity in defense/war campaign`.

But, if we follow logic of Serbian language (not sure for Polish on this one), `kinsmen` would be in connection to Serbian word `rod/rodjak, rasa` (cousin, race) that refers to `kinship` in same tribal and even racial origin. But, later more on this. Topic is very interesting.

In any case, attempting to understand meaning if ethnic name of Serbs we would learn much about Sarmatian name that in its original (native given) form was based on `Serb` name. In that sense think of local variations of Sarmatian name (that is foreign given form) within realm of our ancients > Serbja, Serby, Srbi, .... Then, we have variation preserved in the name of Siberia in Russia or even Sorbona in France (this example forcing me to think that maybe `Sorb` form existed within realm of the ancients as one of native forms (in some region) but, later, after assimilation and destruction of natives that form turned to be, by invaders, also assimilated and used to designate rest of Serbs/ie Sarmatians).
Crow 150 | 9,537
25 Jul 2017 #92
Lusatian-Sarmatic obsession of Poles

Oh, that? I understand that. I am dreamer myself. Back then in our deep past, when Sarmatian realm stretched on inter-continental level, ancients had good life. Everything was more simple in the land of green and land of free. Not that it was easy but, man was a man and woman was a woman. Child, too. You had solidarity in everything and you had plenty of opportunities to live as `lone wolf. One could travel on all four sides of the world, all his life and. one could never see anything else but only land of Sarmatians.
Bobko 9 | 156
25 Jul 2017 #93
One could travel on all four sides of the world, all his life and. one could never see anything else but only land of Sarmatians.

Seems boring to me. There's value in diversity.
Crow 150 | 9,537
26 Jul 2017 #94
Then don`t worry. You`ll get extra diversity. Just walk round the next corner and one muja would be there waiting.
AndrzejKonst - | 5
28 Jul 2017 #95
To all of you! You are wonderful! I am so glad reviving this discussion!

The subject, on slightly wider basis than only Slavic roots in Europe, is very interesting, and, in my opinion, very important, especially in so called modern world seeking its roots.

Let take into account India. One friends of my, Indian mathematician very strongly involved into the history of his homeland, years ago had turned my attention to some astonishing facts from this history and, as the mathematician, some illogical statements and conclusions of so called "Oxford historians". They simply have "sticked" two rulers named Chandragupta for to make Indian history slightly shorter! It has not been possible for them to admit that such a "barbarian" country possess so long history! After differentiating this two rulers, everything goes back to the right position and there is no longer gap in a timeline between Mohenjo Daro civilization and "pure Indian" roots and... achievements.

After all, the Indo-Europeans and Slavic tribes had gone out into the wide world from the exactly same place north of Caspian sea and south of Ural mountains, the very specific region, very important for Cro Magnon human beings.

Andrzej Konstantynowicz
AndrzejKonst - | 5
28 Jul 2017 #96
To Ziemowit8.

Recently, I have observed the same type of behaviour at so called "expants". I have an acquaintance from my pub, Muslim, living in Poland from more then 20 years, even married here. But lately, seems to be driven by TV propaganda, he has started to express some strange opinions on me, our collegues, Polish people, situation in Poland an so on. Nobody of us in the pub prosecute this man, and it seems that he feel herself very unhappy exactly from this reason - it is very hard to stay martyr without prosecution. Nobody of us in the pub can understand this situation. A few months ago, during "night talkings with beer in the background" I've heard from him, that this opinions and attitudes have been announced to him during some special meetings in Warsaw with the "old and esteemed men" - may be even "Sheikhs". What to do when meeting such a situation? Is there anybody who know how to dam such a stream of hatred?

Andrzej Konstantynowicz
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,852
28 Jul 2017 #97
I have an acquaintance from my pub, Muslim,

no you do not, what nonsense.
Crow 150 | 9,537
28 Jul 2017 #98
To all of you! You are wonderful! I am so glad reviving this discussion!

Blessings of Christ and Svetovid on you, dobri prijatelju.

Yes, I feel wonderful and wish the same to you.

no you do not, what nonsense.

Tell me, what is nonsense there. Will you
rozumiemnic 8 | 3,852
28 Jul 2017 #99
Tell me, what is nonsense there. Will you

1. Muslims do not hang around in pubs....generally. Why would they?
2. the person who wrote this is just making up some nonsense to be provocative.

you do see that dont you Crowie?
mafketis 29 | 9,849
28 Jul 2017 #100
This attitude is rather common among the expats living in Poland who come to post on this forum

Quick typology of forum members

1) Expats/Longterm residents of Poland who think that Poland needs to change as much as possible in the direction of the UK (because reasons)

2) Expats/Longterm residents with no such thought, they have the normal quibbles that come with living in a foreign country

3) Diaspora Poles with a realistic attitude toward the country

4) Diaspora Poles with strange, unrealistic attitudes toward the country (usually stuck in the past and/or trying to 'rebuild' a past that never existed)

5) South Asians who show up to ask a single question (that they easily could find for themselves if they searched for three seconds) and then disappear forever

6) crow (sui generis...)

7) slimy repulsive entities that appear from another dimension

8) people with some ancestory in Poland with questions about citizenship/inheritance

9) random passers by

There used to be (but not so much anymore)

10) western guys wanting translations because they think their girlfriends are cheating on them

11) western guys who don't realize their girlfriends are trying to gently dump them (forcing their girlfriends into drastic action to get rid of them)

12) non-Polish women wondering what the he1l is up with Polish men, how did they get that way?
Ziemowit 13 | 4,439
28 Jul 2017 #101
Quick typology of forum members

A very interesting typology indeed. The next step could be trying to assign every (or exemplary) member to a particular category (excluding Crow as he constitutes a category for himself).

Prey tell into which category would you assign me as I cannot find anything for myself :-).
mafketis 29 | 9,849
28 Jul 2017 #102
Prey tell into which category would you assign me

I was thinking 3 (I was under the impression that you live in the UK...)

back on topic please
Crow 150 | 9,537
28 Jul 2017 #103

generally. As you said.

Why would they?

some of them? because they feel like normal Europeans, for example. You know, in former Yugoslavia was many Bosnian muslims that were normal Europeans, prior NATO, EU and Islamic league made a deal and manipulated with them and introduced on them Nazi-Islam ideology (created by Germany During WWII).

the person who wrote this is just making up some nonsense to be provocativ

Many here would say that you talk about me

you do see that dont you Crowie?

Its just glad to me that I`m not the only crazy on this forum
Ziemowit 13 | 4,439
28 Jul 2017 #104
I was under the impression that you live in the UK

No, I don't.

back on topic please

This is on-topic. The majority of the groups listed by Maf in his typology consist of people who are either Luzatians or Sarmatians which is why those posts are on topic. And the thread is devoted to "Lusatian-Sarmatic obsession", isn't it?
mafketis 29 | 9,849
28 Jul 2017 #105
people who are either Luzatians or Sarmatians

When it comes right down to it, wouldn't it have made a lot more sense if Kennedy said "Ich bin ein Sarmater!"?
Crow 150 | 9,537
20 Jan 2018 #106
On January 14. was the anniversary of death of one true Sarmatian.


General Pavle from Zgorzelec (1848-1922), Hero of all Serbs- of all last bearers of venerable Sarmatian name

Pavle Evgenije Jurišić "Šturm" (born Paulus Eugen Sturm), Lusatanian Serb, veteran in Serbian-Turkish wars, military educated and also promoted field commander for exemplary military virtue, during WWI commandeered to the 3rd Serbian army during famous Battle of Cer- first allied victory in WWI. By his brilliant commanding, Serbian 3rd army timely prevented penetration of Austrio-Hungarian army behind flanks of Serbian 1rst army what allowed to general Stepa Stepanovic to inflict decisive strike into the enemy and victory was won.

To give you picture of high level of Serbian victory over much more numerous opponent, I will give you some numbers. Austro-Hungaria lost in battle more then 25.000 soldiers and Serbia below 4.800 soldiers. Complete route and panic fleeing of Austro-Hungarin army occurred.

It was this battle when Austro-Hungaria effectively died and that even yet wasn`t aware of that, no matter that snake still managed to inflict great suffering onto the Serbian people in years to come. After this battle, in every next conflict of Serbian-AH army, moral among mobilized Slavs, subjects of the AH Empire was so low and pro-Serbian that history recorded how complete regiments and battalions consisting of Czechs, Slovaks and Poles were turning to Serbian side against their former AH masters. Only when Germany sent huge reinforcements and after Bulgaria betrayed alliance with Serbs and hit us from the back, Serbia started to losing battles.

Till the end of WWI, Serbia lost 1/3 of its population, liberating in the process itself, complete Slavic South and Slavic Adriatic coast, pursuing AH army all the way to Vienna until the final dissolution of AH Empire.

Is there any monument or street name in Poland dedicated to General Pavle, Lusatian Serb from Zgorzelec ?? Any ?? I hope that exist. How so much he contributed to independence and freedom of Poland. I hope that Poles didn`t forget him. It would be sin.

Decorations and medals of General Pavle, Lusatian Serb from Zgorzelec


Serbian military decorations

Serbian Service Medals

Long live Lusatia eterna!

Tacitus 2 | 1,337
3 Feb 2018 #107
Always nice to see when a German played a positive role in another countries history ;)
Lyzko 30 | 7,716
3 Feb 2018 #108
Try General von Steuben in the US (...before it became the United States of America)! The Prussian fought shoulder to shoulder with General Washington, plus, it was yet another German, Emanuel Leutze, whose painting of Washington crossing the Delaware prior to reaching Valley Forge, which remains one of the most indelible images in all of US history to this day. And there's always the former printer John Peter Zenger who was the first to openly champion freedom of speech in the colonies.

Crow 150 | 9,537
3 Feb 2018 #109
Scratch the surface and you realize how are Germans in fact Slavs. Fortunately, some of them are aware of it.

Some of them, like General Pavle, Lusatian Serb from Zgorzelec, always were aware of it.
Tacitus 2 | 1,337
3 Feb 2018 #110
The man was from Görlitz though. Zgorzelec did not yet exist.
Crow 150 | 9,537
3 Feb 2018 #111
Alright, Görlitz is at the moment located in German state of Saxony. But, even in its German form word `Görlitz` is of Slavic origin. Polish: Zgorzelec, Upper Sorbian: Zhorjelc, Lower Sorbian: Zgórjelc, Czech: Zhořelec.

General Pavle himself used to say that he was born in `Gerlic` (not in Görlitz) and also used Polish form of word `Zgorzelec`.

General Pavle was in pain that Lusatia still suffer German yoke. So he loved everything Serbian, no matter northern- Lusatian or southern- Balkan. And he served Serbdom and Slavdom well.
dolnoslask 6 | 3,074
3 Feb 2018 #112
Görlitz is at the moment located in German state of Saxony.

lets hope it don't move too far, great place for a visit, of course the home of the grand hotel budapest.
Tacitus 2 | 1,337
3 Feb 2018 #113
Görlitz has a particulary beautiful city center that was extensively restored after German reunification.
dolnoslask 6 | 3,074
3 Feb 2018 #114
Oh i know it well I visit once a month, nice Polish restaurant the other side of the freedom Bridge, gorlitz is a must see especially new years eve.
Crow 150 | 9,537
3 Feb 2018 #115
Now, when you know. Please, next time you are there, go in Church there, whatever Church, and give one prayer for general Pavle, presumably, you are Polish or any Slavic soul. Man contributed to independence of Poland, too. To liberation of all Slavs within A-H and Ottoman Empire.

Also, he was one of ever greatest, untold and not openly mentioned, military genius. Its a rare talent and luck for one general commander to take part in crucial battles that led to crumbling of two empires. General Pavle by his military virtue helped in putting down Ottoman Turkish and Austro-Hungarian Empires. True, true genuine commander of all times. And great Sarmatian. May he rest in peace.
Tacitus 2 | 1,337
3 Feb 2018 #116
Not that I blame him for fighting for his chosen home country, but it is regreattable that he took part in the greatest geopolitical tragedy of the 20th century. The Balkans experienced under the Habsburgs a time of never known time of prosperity, and the collapse of AH lead to so many tragedies later on.

We are still trying to undo the damage to this day.
Ktos 16 | 440
4 Feb 2018 #117

Read something and eat something to think better and read with better understanding. What have you written here moreon this and more on that from you and readers will become morons.

Whether our aristocrats were Sarmatians or not is not proven or unproven, Slavic history requires much deeper studies and exploration.
cms 9 | 1,255
4 Feb 2018 #118
Sobieski died a few years ago Ktos. Unlike you he is missed around here.
Lyzko 30 | 7,716
4 Feb 2018 #119
@Crow, is it not possible that maybe the reverse is true, that all Slavs have more than a little German in them, more that is, than many might care to admit?
Crow 150 | 9,537
4 Feb 2018 #120
Impossible. Even theoretically impossible. No matter how romantic it may sound to some. No matter how some may wish for it. Scientific truth is final absolute.

See, Germans and Germanics in general, same as Romano-Brits, English, French, Hungarians, etc, etc represent ethoses formed out of cultural movement that was result of inter-cultural exchanges. It all happened within Sarmatian world (and sometimes stimulated by contacts with non-Europeans). Those are quite sold facts. No space for any denial of it.

We have evidences how Ice age advanced across Europe. We have evidences how human and animal populations retreated due to glaciation. We have evidences of Ice age refugiums. Then we have evidences of retreat of ice and slow advance of population and animals and new resettling of Europe along the rivers network. Its all pretty logical and had its natural laws. Then, we know how Romans drawn their borders from within Sarmatian realm. Sarmatians were inside and outside of Roman borders. Influences, cultural exchanges. Simple, all what is White in Europe is of Sarmatian (ie Slavic) origin. In origin and well, they sure have right to be whatever they want to be now or in future.

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