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A little reminder for those Brits that ***** about Poles


Ironside 51 | 11,339
13 Mar 2012 #121
Nice to know that you also lied about putting me on your ignore list.

Oh but I did. You know that you can remove poster from ignore list as well.

the question of what assistance it was within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given.

They should have bombed German military installations as they promised. Not that British ruling class was short of promises and treaties they never intended to honor.

The point is they had never intended (like France )to honor that treaty.
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #122
They should have bombed German military installations as they promised.

They did. Stop lying about the brave British airmen who died fighting for your freedom and theirs: nearly as many British airmen died on the first day of raids on German targets (4 September) as Polish airmen died in the entire Battle of Britain. I have never heard a British person deny that those Poles fought, so why do you feel the need to deny that those British airmen fought? Are you really that low?

The point is they had never intended (like France )to honor that treaty.

The point is that you are utterly unable to go into detail about what assistance it was within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given; instead you just tell foul lies.
Trevek 26 | 1,702
13 Mar 2012 #123
They should have bombed German military installations as they promised.

Well, they bombed German naval targets on September 4th and continued sorties, even bombing the Ruhr and Monchengladbach in early 1940

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strategic_bombing_during_World_War_II#The_Western_Front.2C_1939_to_June_1940
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #124
Well, they bombed German naval targets on September 4th and continued sorties, even bombing the Ruhr and Monchengladbach in early 1940

They also managed to bomb targets in Denmark (on 4 September), which tells you a lot about the level of training in the RAF at the time and why it wouldn't have been a clever idea to try to bomb German cities.
Ironside 51 | 11,339
13 Mar 2012 #125
They did.

did they ? Well everyday I can learn something new. Could perhaps point out where those bombing were exercised. How many German military installations had been bombed and how many German planes had been withdrawn form the front in Poland to be used against that new threat?

Hell, I'm all ears!

Stop lying about the brave British airmen who died fighting for your freedom and theirs:

Lying ? Are you delusional I haven't said the word about British airmen. Do not change the subject.
We talking about British ruling class.

he point is that you are utterly unable to go into detail about what assistance it was within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given; instead you just tell foul lies.

The point is that you are asking about those details to muddle the simple issue we are presented with here - Britain in September 1939 haven't given any significant military assistance to Poland.

Anyway all those issues had to be coordinated with French land offensive expected on the 14 September.
What would be the point of presenting a plan of the air campaign with listed German targets other than your nitpick at it.
We are Talking about political decisions, because decision not to help Poland as promised had been a political decision and have a little to do with military issues.

Well, they bombed German naval targets on September 4th and continued sorties, even bombing the Ruhr and Monchengladbach in early 1940

In 1939, following the German invasion of Poland, the United Kingdom and France declared war on Germany and the war in the West began. Britain attempted to bomb German warships and light vessels in several harbors on 3 and 4 September

It is not what I would call campaign. Also for Poland only September matters, not that one bomb a month would make a lot of difference.

Campaign according to McMillan dictionary:

a series of actions by an army trying to win a war
I don't see series of action aimed at wining the war but rather pathetic attempts at harassing the enemy.
According to the free dictionary :
1.A series of military operations undertaken to achieve a large-scale objective during a war. (What was the goal of said bombings?)
2. An operation or series of operations energetically pursued to accomplish a purpose. ( what purpose ? Making Hitler agitated in hope he will have a heart attack?)

3.To engage in an operation planned to achieve a certain goal. ( what would be a goal of those bombings ? An excuse at honoring the treaty? so called smokescreen to hid the fact that treaty with Poland was intentionally broken by the political decision ?)
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #126
did they ? Well everyday I can learn something new.

Please try harder with your lies. You knew about those missions. I covered themhere and you took part in that thread repeatedly. Sobieski mentioned one raid and you took part in that thread.

And before you claim that those threads were so long ago that you have forgotten them, let's have a look at the very first page of this thread.

You have claimed that German targets were not attacked. Such targets were attacked and British airmen died making those attacks. Stop lying about them.

The point is that you are asking about those details to muddle the simple issue we are presented with here - Britain in September 1939 haven't given any significant military assistance to Poland.

And back we come to the question which you will clearly refuse to answer until hell freezes over: what assistance was it within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given?

Anyway all those issues had to be coordinated with French land offensive expected on the 14 September.

What British troops were able to take part in that offensive?

decision not to help Poland as promised had been a political decision and have a little to do with military issues.

Instead of just repeating your lie, why not answer the question of what assistance was it within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given?

Oh sorry, I forgot that you can not answer that question and that we all know the real answer to the question (which is why you refuse to answer it).
TheOther 6 | 3,692
13 Mar 2012 #127
I don't see your problem, guys. Britain and France declared war on Germany (not vice versa) and officially started WW2 with that declaration. They could as well have ignored the attack on Poland, and you would all speak German (or Russian) today if that would have happened.

Whether Britain and France really came to the aid of Poland or just had their own agenda (keeping Germany from going imperial again) in mind, is another question. I tend to believe that they were more worried about global competition than about Poland.
Ironside 51 | 11,339
13 Mar 2012 #128
Whether Britain and France really came to the aid of Poland

Thats the point !

I don't see your problem

I don't see your problem.

Britain and France declared war on Germany (not vice versa) and officially started WW2 with that declaration. They could as well have ignored the attack on Poland, and you would all speak German (or Russian) today if that would have happened.

Really ? They could as well join Germany in their war against Poland.Should we thank them for their restrain or maybe you should read less of the S-F literature ?
TheOther 6 | 3,692
13 Mar 2012 #129
Did Britain and France declare war on Germany - yes or no? What more do you want? As I said, they could've closed their eyes and just wait until everything was over. Like they did when Germany invaded Czechoslovakia.
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #130
Thats the point !

But still you refuse to answer the question of what assistance was it within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given.

Nevermind IS, it is clear to all that you know as well as the rest of us what the answer to that question is.

Whether Britain and France really came to the aid of Poland or just had their own agenda (keeping Germany from going imperial again) in mind, is another question. I tend to believe that they were more worried about global competition than about Poland.

The British were viewed by Hitler as natural allies of Germany. And vice versa by some sections of British society.

They could as well join Germany in their war against Poland.

If France had stuck by her treaty obligations to Czechoslovakia, she would have declared war on Poland and so would the USSR. Hard to see Poland doing anything then other than siding with the Nazis even more so than she already did during the Munich debacle.
Ironside 51 | 11,339
13 Mar 2012 #131
Did Britain and France declare war on Germany - yes or no? What more do you want?

So what ? You seems to be failing to see that France and Britain didn't honored their treaty with Poland by not delivering military help as promised.

Your speculation about what could happened are just pure s-f stuff!

Like they did when Germany invaded Czechoslovakia.

They haven't had a mutual defense treaty with CS specifically mentioned Germany and CS didn't defend herself at all.

But still you refuse to answer the question of what assistance was it within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given.

I refuse to discus with you on your terms ie accepting your stipulations.
I say.

First of all Britain and France meant to coordinate their military efforts against Germany.
Secondly the treaty mean for them to take military action imminently.
It was specified that France should lunch major offensive against Germany no later than14 of September.
British supposed to bomb German military installation and use their Navy.
In fact they never honored their promises and obligation no matter how hard you try to justify it!Facts are facts!
You questions are asked in malicious intend of sidestepping the issue!
France and Britain meant to act together, and it doesn't matter if the blame for abandoning Poland lies with France in 50% or 51%, Britain share that responsibility.

The British were viewed by Hitler as natural allies of Germany.

Jews were viewed as pests by Hitler - so what ?
Poland was offered place in Hitler's camp - and ?
Stop talking rubbish just to justify your views.
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #132
You seems to be failing to see that France and Britain didn't honored their treaty with Poland by not delivering military help as promised.

Why do you keep repeating this claim when you are unable to say what assistance it was within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given?

First of all Britain and France meant to coordinate their military efforts against Germany.

Show me the part of the treaty which says that.

Secondly the treaty mean for them to take military action imminently.

They did.

It was specified that France should lunch major offensive against Germany no later than14 of September.

Show me the part of the Anglo-Polish treaty which says that.

British supposed to bomb German military installation and use their Navy.

They did. Stop lying about the hundreds of British service men who gave their lives.

In fact they never honored their promises and obligation no matter how hard you try to justify it!Facts are facts!

Can you go into detail about how Britain failed to honour her obligations? Will you? No, you will not because you can not.
Ironside 51 | 11,339
13 Mar 2012 #133
Why do you keep repeating this claim when you are unable to say what assistance it was within Britain's power to give in September or October 1939 which was not given?

I answered many times stop your repetitive lies ! they should have Bombed German military installations, I mean full scale air raids, not some token and random actions.

Show me the part of the treaty which says that.

Look for it yourself!

They did.

No they didn't ! There were not major military offensive against Germany in September 1939, are you compulsive lier ?

They did. Stop lying about the hundreds of British service men who gave their lives.

They didn't ! you are an idiot if you really believe that those token actions were fulfilling obligations to Poland ?We both know that you are not an idiot just a sick man who get his kicks from it.Stop it.

Can you go into detail about how Britain failed to honour her obligations? Will you? No, you will not because you can not.

I can, and I did answer you many time, stop lying that I didn't.
Stop lying about me lying but you of curse cannot because you have health problems.
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #134
the should have Bomb German military installations

They did. Stop lying about that. The losses where prohibitive and the crews showed they were not able to reliably bomb even the correct country.

Look for it yourself!

You are claiming that the Anglo-Polish treaty says that "First of all Britain and France meant to coordinate their military efforts against Germany.", it is you who has to prove it says that.

They didn't !

Why do you insist on lying about the hundred of British servicemen who gave their lives in September 1939 for your freedom and theirs? Can you really sink so low as to completely deny their sacrifice?

I can, and I did answer you many time, stop lying that I didn't.

You have not, you will not and you cannot. I'm sorry that this causes you so much anger, perhaps you'd find more peace if you faced up to the fact that the reality of history is not as you would like it to be.

you are not an idiot just a sick man

you have health problems.

Really showing the strength of your position with your increasing reliance on insults
andrew jab - | 33
13 Mar 2012 #135
Do you by any chance happen to have a source to support that claim? Or is it just another lie?

'Behind closed doors',a BBC production,watch it,it might enlighten you.
Next question.
PS You still seem to be convieniently cherry picking the issues i have posted.
I wont hold my breath waiting for a reply,oh sorry you did reply yesterday,something along the lines of it being off topic,how convenient.
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #136
'Behind closed doors',a BBC production,watch it,it might enlighten you.

I found the book to be noticeably better than the DVD and neither are Rees' finest work but your views may vary. I can't for the life of me remember in which program (or chapter) to find the quote you claim is there. Could you perhaps remind me?

you did reply yesterday,something along the lines of it being off topic,how convenient.

The moderators here have a very fixed view that going off topic is a very bad thing to do. But as I said yesterday, I'd be more than happy to discuss topics which would be off topic here in threads where they would be on topic.
Crow 153 | 10,742
13 Mar 2012 #137
One year as Russian gubernia and England would be region full of decent people
andrew jab - | 33
13 Mar 2012 #138
Could you perhaps remind me?

I watched the dvd haven't seen the book but its along the lines of ' i know the ruskies are killing your best assets as they advance into Poland'blah blah,but im still going to sell your asses down the river anyway,for now though your men are needed.
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #139
i know the ruskies are killing your best assets as they advance into Poland'blah blah,but im still going to sell your asses down the river anyway,for now though your men are needed.

A very interesting claim. Could you please make a thread about it so I can reply to it there.
Crow 153 | 10,742
13 Mar 2012 #140
Harry

expose yourself to Polonication.
andrew jab - | 33
13 Mar 2012 #141
A very interesting claim. Could you please make a thread about it so I can reply to it there.

LOL.
Dont try to play clever with me larry you know full well what im talking about.
He told anders how proud he was of the polish efforts and how sorry he was of the situation in poland and how britian had gone to war to protect polands integrity.

You know full as does everyone else well he had no intention of honouring that commitment.
Now run along and bore someone else with your weasle words.(which match the goverments actions BEFORE DURING AND AFTER WW2 REGARDING POLAND).
Harry
13 Mar 2012 #142
Could a moderator advise whether this is on-topic enough to be replied to?
pgtx 30 | 3,156
13 Mar 2012 #143
Thread closed for cleaning.

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