Polish historical myths - to break or not to break them?

is actually about hussar`s swords.
husaria.jest.pl/ciekawo.html

When was the last time you spoke or read Polish? :):):)

You are right , it was exactly like you are saying


The view ( less significant) and the noise together .

The quoted historian claims that the noise of the battle was so intense that feather whistling was practically unheard.[/quote]
Yes , the problem is , one historian agains the whole bunch of others , did he make any experiment on the real battlefield , most certainly not .


Why are you so snappish ?
Do you know my achievements ? Maybe you should inform me about my achievements I will be glad to find out .

The worst idea is to start personal stuff , instead of supporting own . But I guess you have ran out of yours :)

I'm about half way through Głębowicz's article it’s extremely Interesting far from a scribble but difficult for me.

Edit


That’s not what the article says, the author reports eye witness accounts describing tactics to frighten horses.

Yours are even more worthless , sorry .

It is a little chaotic but facts seem plausible.


No need to be sorry. But can you provide the source, please?
:):):):)

Sorry Ironside, my answer was meant for Pawian , don`t know why my PC quoted your name , but I did that unintentionally .

Why are you asking for more sources if you said that mine were worthless . You will say the same about another, as they will be contradictory with yours .

Indeed the psychological impact similar to tooled up anti terrorist forces.

Dont mess with GROM:)

I will say it again if you insist that your quote concerning swords is about wings. :):):):)


Not to anything mine, but to the rules of translation and of common sense. :):):):)

Are you nutts ? I am Polish .

This website is in polish only , but you can copy and paste into Google translator , so it will be readable for you . You can ask your students to translate the text for you , as a homework :) lol.

[quote="Przepych zbroi i stroju łączy się u nich z poczuciem wielkiej wygody: wielu z nich ma przytroczony do siodła pod udem długi na 4-6 stóp rożen, a pod gołym niebem obozując, wielce zręcznie złapany i oskubany drób wszelki na nim pieką"

Oto do jakiej -w oczach cudzoziemca- roli zdegradowana została wspaniała broń- koncerz. [/i]

husaria.jest.pl/ciekawo.html

I think you should certainly use this option.

Don`t you know that teachers and students are having vacation now? :):):):)

Monia so for those of you who are in Poland you write in Polish and it gets shows in English?

My citation is about swords and wings , you shoul read my text more carefully. Try :):):):)

What about my achievements anyway ?


There are some pictures of me on PF , could the lady with this smile be paranoid ? C`mon you don`t believe even a little bit in this .

Why can`t you contribute to this thread yourself , do some research , maybe you could find some english source for Pawian :D.


What do you mean ? Are you talking about google translator ? But you can find this website yourself and it translates any major language into any major language, like any other web dictionary . But this is not very helpful with grammar and translates without rhyme or reason.

I am trying to read it for the 5th time, but it is only about swords. :):):):)


Like the one we are talking about. :):):):)

This is about wings :


Another link with google translation :

pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Husaria#Uzbrojenie_husarza

Quite odd, but characteristic of the formation of a piece of equipment was the pen. These Feathers, contrary to established schemes, were not only an eagle, falcon often, hawks, and sometimes a raven, and even the geese, which can easily explain the price and availability. Initially, they were worn on hats, helmets, sticks copy discs, with the horses' legs, as well as the famous wings.

To this day, in the minds of Poles is encoded picture hussar with two wings attached to the backplate armor. This is a picture not so much wrong as misleading. Well, a lot more wing or wing (usually used for one) attached to the rear saddle, and that's after the occupation of the hussar of the saddle [note 10]. Very often it was used only for popisach wings and parades. There are several theories to justify the use of wings: the most reasonable seems to be the one that sees feathers, or wings, part of psychological warfare. In fact, the wings could frighten the horses of the enemy, but not the noise, the noise of battle which no one would have heard, but its appearance.

It should be noted that many pieces of equipment hussars had just affect the psyche of the enemy. Flapping and eyes flashing colors mamiły attacked the enemy with copies hussar banners. During his many years in Poland French engineer Guillaume le Vasseur de Beauplan noted:

"At the tips of his back waving banners that are either white and red, or blue-green or black and white. But always remain two-color and 4 to 5 yards long [21]. This is probably designed to frighten enemy horses. Since the [hussars] leave their copies of rushing at the horse pops, banners, these are spinning around, arousing fear the enemy's horses, which they want to break ranks. "[22] Although detailed description, Beauplan no mention in it about using the wings. A common use of wings by the hussars, however, mention the other authors of the seventeenth century visitors to the Commonwealth as Karl Ogier in 1635 [23], Sebastian Cefali in 1665 and Francois Paul D `Alerac in 1689.

The use of the wings of hussars also mention the authors of the eighteenth century as if Jedrzej Kitowicz Steinhauser writes: "They had wings composed of a wooden strip screwed to the waist, high on top of the head, above a curved head, a variety of colors with their feathers painted an olive branch or palm imitating, making oddly beautiful view, but this laurel, not all squadrons have used "[24]. Some seventeenth-century authors emphasized the practical application of the wings "sticking out on the shoulders of their lofty wings to frighten enemies" [23].

With passage of the letter przypowiedniego Stefan Batory Foundation for the haul rota Bielawski hussar, "and the feathers and other ornaments for the grandeur and terror of the enemy depending on the tastes of each" show that the use of feathers was not mandatory. However, it represented widespread custom among the Polish driving record as confirmed by the regulations for the Lithuanian hussars of 1746 years saying, "The ancient custom wings for postal use on sheet metal rear stops." Not all the hussars wore the obligatory piece of equipment, which can also provide images of the era and relationships, not to mention the wings.

In our consciousness Hussar wings grounded until the nineteenth-century painters like Joseph Brandt and Wojciech Kossak and contemporary for us air force and armored units, which in its symbolic use of this element hussar armor. Many hussar armor, appearing today in the existing museum collections, have been fitted with wings only in the nineteenth century and the result is very difficult to determine the actual use of skrzydeł.W many sources using "wings" hussar was the beginning of the battle with the Tartars. Tatars who value captives seized on the so-called jeźców. valuable insight into. Hussar wings mounted either on the back or the saddle, effectively prevented the abandonment of the rope, or facilitate the escape of the loop. Use them to fight another opponent does not matter much but probably because of "terrible appearance" of such a rider were used. In addition to the decoration of feathers visible hussars were skins of wild animals. It is characteristic that usually wore husarscy companions (as an outer garment armor) tiger or leopard skin, while the officers (governors, lieutenants) wolf skins, bears and lynx, which sometimes led to misunderstandings [note 11].

Splendor [edit]
Hussars during the parade in 1605 in Krakow, presented at the Polish Rulonie

Hussars, in the ranks of the unstable distributions of the first families of the sons of the Republic, distinguished by the richness of costume and weaponry. Everything (in addition to those skins) from the gleaming gold and precious stones.

Up to 100 words.

I didn`t read this text in Polish at all ( the first one ) , just copied and translated by google and posted here , so I am reading it for the first time , in Polish , now

.But here is a full desription of those wings armour in my last post :):):).

According to a popular saying, the pen is mightier than the sword? :):):):):)



Hey, isn`t it time you gave up google translation? :):):):):)

It translated Polish pióra as pen instead of feathers.


No more, please! :):):):):):) Do you want to kill me with laughter? :):):)

Besides, you are contradicting yourself.

Ha, ha , ha , ha see that google can`t translate properly ( in Polish a word " pióro" = pen , feather )

Why? I read your source in English.it mentioned nothing about wings. Frankly ,as a military historian,granted with not much knowledge of specifically Winged Hussars I also tend to agree with the assesments pawian pointed out regarding simple physics,ie,you strap stupid great wings to your back then attempt to charge on horseback you are going to get dragged backwards. Whatsmore, the so called scary sound.............Oh, behave, in a battle with cannons roaring,muskets firing,dead and dying screaming and the thunder of thousands of hooves charging................bah, sorry,but youd need a set of marshal stack amps turned up to 11 to make any whistly whiny sound heard.........................

So,in short, Polish Hussars did exist. Did they wear huge wings into battle? Probably as ofton as Vikings wore horns in their helmets.*

* Vikings never wore horns in their helmets,it was a 19th century revisionism/romantisism thing,much as the whole wings in battle seems to be.

Just a bthought here but.....if Winged Hussars were such a war winning thing (which,in their day the hussars were undoubtadly) didnt Napoleon form any Winged hussars units either in his imperial army directly or within the Duchy of Warsaw forces?

He certainly employed Lancers,or Uhlans,both Polish and French "Polish" lancers,in fact, Britain copied the idea in many ways for our lancers,even down to the flat topped four pointed helmet :)

My suggestion for this would be that back in 1812 people who actually went to war on horseback knew fine well that the wings thing was a dud and had probably rarely been worn in battle. Sure, pennets of feathers maybe on saddles,but far from the Angel wings one see's in romantic paintings.

Of what ? read my post again.

Jeez , my entire post # 111 was dedicated to just husssar`s wings .

Your comment is just a proof that you don`t understand the entire section , where it was explained why it was helpfull , besides just ask yourself a question :

how were they fighting ? were they fighting on horse one on one ? then , within a range of 1 meter from an enemy and especially to a horse, would it be heard ? ( the noise and its appearance was to stir a panic to a horse )


It is unfortunate, that the only form of transfering the image at that time was just canvas and brush, now you would be getting such message in 3D , skeptic , lol.


Your comment suggests that you didn`t broaden you knowledge about those times . If you did, you wouuld know that :


As you can see that this type of an army was rather expensive , but not only the money issue was relevant ,but also the long process of training of hussars and the breeding of special horses was needed , so Napoleon was inept to have such hussars in his army( know - how ) and didn`t have the slightest idea about it . He was a man gripped by inferiority complex, but with the exaggerated ego to understand that the Poles could help him on his way to victory - perhaps not at all studied the history of arms.

The uniqueness of hussar`s army be proved, how long the process of preparing a special race of horse used by hussars lasted :


About how hard it was to prepare an army of hussars let be proved by this fact :

Yes,where it quite clearly states ;"
To this day, in the minds of Poles is encoded picture hussar with two wings attached to the backplate armor. This is a picture not so much wrong as misleading. Well, a lot more wing or wing (usually used for one) attached to the rear saddle, and that's after the occupation of the hussar of the saddle [note 10]. Very often it was used only for popisach wings and parades."

So,again, Hussars existed, Hussars did not wear huge wings on their backs...............its really rather simple.


lols, I read, "napoleon was inept" then I know Im not dealing with anyone with any serious knowledge.

Jeez , my entire post # 111 was dedicated to just husssar`s wings .

Your comment is just a proof that you don`t understand the entire section , where it was explained why it was helpfull , besides just ask yourself a question :

how were they fighting ? were they fighting on horse one on one ? then , within a range of 1 meter from an enemy and especially to a horse, would it be heard ? ( the noise and its appearance was to stir a panic to a horse )


It is unfortunate, that the only form of transfering the image at that time was just canvas and brush, now you would be getting such message in 3D , skeptic , lol.


Your comment suggests that you didn`t broaden you knowledge about those times . If you did, you wouuld know that :

As you can see that this type of an army was rather expensive , but not only the money issue was relevant ,but also the long process of training of hussars and the breeding of special horses was needed , so Napoleon was inept to have such hussars in his army( know - how ) and didn`t have the slightest idea about it . He was a man gripped by inferiority complex, but with the exaggerated ego to understand that the Poles could help him on his way to victory - perhaps not at all studied the history of arms.

The uniqueness of hussar`s army be proved, how long the process of preparing a special race of horse used by hussars lasted :

About how hard it was to prepare an army of hussars let be proved by this fact :


Source :
pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Husaria#Uzbrojenie_husarza


Do you see the difference when the word "often" is used


Yes, inept of using hussars in his army , lol . Read the whole sentence I gave about him , instead of extracing my words out of context . lol .

Here is what I said :

Whats this then,Scotch Mist?

• 
  French Hussar 8th regt' Eygpt.
  

Does he look like this :
These are Polish hussars , not kind of poor imitation by Napoleon soldiers .

Here is another link depicting the battle with hussars:

LMFAO.................its fact,nationalists really are hilarious as long as they have no power :):):)
Sooooo Napoleons armies were a poor imitation of Polands,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,yes,of course dear,nurse will see you soon with the little yellow pills .......
That would be a non existent poland only given a crumb of exsistence by the fact napoleon liberated land that had once been Polish..............but of course, in your mind im sure it was the Duchy of Warsaw who conquered europe,fought battles on 3 continents,defeated europes strongest armies and liberated france to boot...........................it must be lovely to live in cukoo land monia,unfortunatly its history,its known,you are quite simply wrong,but of course,being monia uber Pole of course the entire world is wrong,you are right.............................

That simple, winged hussars were outdated in XVIII century and not effective anymore.
Them were replaced by them:



and during Napoleon times by that:

szwolez.jpg - Old Polish uniform

and they kicked your as*s!

er.............no.Britains forces kinda kicked french arse out of Iberia then kicked french arse at waterloo, those two campaigns aside britain did not really fight on land as such,we tended to leave that to jonny European....................

But, FYI, those are Lancers/Uhlans you dope :)


Thanks,can you tell Monia that? That was my point......they didnt stick wings on them because it was a stupid thing to do,simple as.

That is the fiction, hardly worthy to discus.

But you have long been lying in a closed psychiatric ward of some hospital in breaks for pissing , they give you a laptop , so you can show off something, in torpor, within your therapy . :):):)


Are you talking about entire world , honey , just take a nap , no need for straining your brain .

Tip to spot napoleonic hussars, Fur lined short jackets,often worn cape like over one shoulder, and bizzarly enough, sort of braided "jewish" sideburn type thingys,like pig tails but infront of the ears :)

The fine chaps in your pictures are lancers,and yes,rightly feared and admired by their opponents,including us Brits, like I said earlier,we directly copied napoleons "Polish lancers" for our own Lancer regiments(ssshhhh,did someone say Charge of the light brigade ? ;)n ).