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Was Slonina (Lard) originally extracted from Elephant meat?


sylvio
1 Sep 2014  #1
Would anyone ever tried to find out if "slonina" was originally extracted from elephant meat?
Wulkan - | 3,251
1 Sep 2014  #2
Yes it is from elephant, too bad we killed them all :-/
Marysienka 1 | 195
1 Sep 2014  #3
słonina dawn. 'każda rzecz solona', potem 'solona wieprzowina', później 'solony tłuszcz spod skóry' w odróżnieniu od niesolonego (reg.) bilu

eduteka.pl/doc/etymologia
Crow 137 | 7,588
1 Sep 2014  #4
Interesting

Would anyone ever tried to find out if "slonina" was originally extracted from elephant meat?

Is this the same what is in Serbian `slanina`? i suppose so

Yes it is from elephant, too bad we killed them all :-/

There is much more in it then possibility that elephants were all eaten, in the vicinity of Poles.

This could be taken as one of proofs that ancestors of modern day Poles originally populated Poland from the Balkan along the Danube river. Then, if we have `feed-back` of the word `slonina` - `slanina` on direction South-East to the Northern Europe (and if it is for sure based on the elephant meat), we can, by the evolution of language, say that this could be proof that speaks in the favor of Slavic autohtonicity in Europe.

Spot this... one of oldest Europe`s Mammoth`s skeletons is found in Serbia (500.000 years old), on Balkan (that was Ice age refugium during periods of glaciations; refugium means that it was place where was warmer climate and was possible for human civilization to exist in Europe during Ice age; when Ice age finished people started to disperse deeper in continent- always (!), preferable along rivers)

Mammoth skeleton pulled from Serbian mine

Marko Drobnjakovic, The Associated Press
Published Friday, April 11, 2014 12:38PM EDT

ctvnews.ca/sci-tech/mammoth-skeleton-pulled-from-serbian-mine-1.1771738

Serbian archaeologists on Friday used heavy machinery to move a female mammoth skeleton -- believed to be one million years old -- from an open mine pit where it was unearthed nearly five years ago.

Serbian archaeologists say Vika is a southern mammoth, or mammuthus meridionalis, one of the oldest species found in Europe, which originated from northern Africa and did not have fur.

Marysienka 1 | 195
1 Sep 2014  #5
ok, I forgot to translate.

słonina dawn. 'każda rzecz solona', potem 'solona wieprzowina', później 'solony tłuszcz spod skóry' w odróżnieniu od niesolonego (reg.) bilu

anything salted->salted pork-> salted fat from under skin (in some regions not salted fat is "bil")
Crow 137 | 7,588
1 Sep 2014  #6
and what is "salty" in Serbian? maybe you got it the same way - salty meat.

in Serbian > `usoljeno meso` > meaning if directly translated in English `meat placed in the salt`. This goes for the kind of meat that is prepared that way... `slanina je usoljeno meso` > could be translated as - `bacon is salted meat`

But, there is also `slano meso` > (for example)... `Meso nije slano` > `Meat isn`t salty`... `staviću so (sol) na meso` > `i will put salt on meat`

Point is,... i don`t know if English language has exact words that differ `usoljeno` and `slano`. What is situation with Polish?

What is also interesting, English word BACON has obvious Slavic origin.

etymonline.com/index.php?term=bacon

early 14c., "meat from the back and sides of a pig" (originally either fresh or cured, but especially cured), from Old French bacon, from Proto-Germanic *bakkon "back meat" (cognates: Old High German bahho, Old Dutch baken "bacon"). Slang phrase bring home the bacon first recorded 1908; bacon formerly being the staple meat of the working class.

see this now

Serbian BATAK means `meat from the back and sides of a pig`. Word `batak` in Serbian coming from word `bat` that in English means `hammer`. `BAT` in `BATAK` because one ``hammering the land`` when he walk.
Marysienka 1 | 195
1 Sep 2014  #7
solone- salted
słone- salty tasiting
Crow 137 | 7,588
1 Sep 2014  #8
słone- salty tasiting

ok. Its `slano` in Serbian

solone- salted

Serbs also say `osoljeno` or `posoljeno` or even `soljeno`- salted (when one eat meat and then add salt to correct the taste of food). `soljeno` could have same meaning with `osoljeno/posoljeno` and `usoljeno`, what depending on context.

`usoljeno` goes for meat that is prepared that way... salted, under pressure, smoked,.. this process is in Serbian known as `salamura`. `stavio sam meso u salamuru` > `i have placed meat in salt (?)`

Shall we back to the topic, please?
Marysienka 1 | 195
1 Sep 2014  #9
to mod: wasn't the topic about słonina? -> we are discussing if it's possible that Serbs and Poles both have the word from salt?

In Polish słonina is lard, not bacon. Also bacon in Polish is boczek - which is diminutive from bok - side.

And słoń- elephant is probably fron different Slavic word słaniać?. Unfortunatly all resources online are both not very respectable and in Polish, and that word(słonić) doesn't exist in modern Polish, although zasłonić, przesłonić, osłonić exist.

Czym się różni słoń od fortepianu? Fortepian można zasłonić, a słonia nie można zafortepianić. :)
Whats the difference between elephant and a grand piano? You can cover ("elephant" zasłonić) a piano, but you can't "grand piano" an elephant.

Crow 137 | 7,588
1 Sep 2014  #10
Shall we back to the topic, please?

well, if you have suggestion how to found out does `slonina` or `slanina` coming from `slon` (elephant) i would appreciate that.

bok

word exist and has same meaning in Serbian, too

lard

yes, some old word in Serbian also sounded like that if not the same. Just I don`t know is it originally Slavic or we (Poles and Serbs) borrowed from some other language.
PC_Sceptic - | 70
2 Sep 2014  #11
`usoljeno` and `slano`

"Salty and salted"

But @Marysienka wins the argument;
Salted meat, cured with the salt to be exact - that then becomes eventually the słonina. Easy to keep in warm temperatures.
Same technique used with the fish and the cabbage > sauerkraut and many other products.

Long ago we had no friges so folks had to find other ways to "fix" the food for longer keeping.
Lard=Smalec > pure smalec, fat only just as the lard is.

Elephant is irrelevant in this whole argument.
Magdalena 3 | 1,837
2 Sep 2014  #12
I can't believe you're having a serious discussion about possible elephant meat consumption in Poland... ;-)
PC_Sceptic - | 70
2 Sep 2014  #13
You never know what future holds :D
jon357 63 | 14,122
3 Sep 2014  #14
I can't believe you're having a serious discussion about possible elephant meat consumption in Poland... ;-)

Why not? My local restaurant sells kangaroo...

You never know though. The OP obviously learned the Polish word for elephant and the Polish word for solid pork fat and thought, "maybe...". Perhaps those old media reports of Poles in the UK eating swan was because they were craving their traditional diet of słon.
Ziemowit 12 | 3,455
4 Sep 2014  #15
An interesting discussion nevertheless! I would have never associated "słonina" to S£ONY before, but it seems to be quite accurate. But while explaining the etymology, one should have used S£ONY rather than SOLONY as in the latter the £ is absent.

All that comes from SÓL (salt) --> S£ONY (salty taste) --> S£ONINA(salted pork fat).
But SÓL may also develop into the verb SOLIĆ (to salt) and its past participle SOLONY (salted).

Perhaps those old media reports of Poles in the UK eating swan was because they were craving their traditional diet of słon [słonina].

That seems indeed plausible! But I am not surprised that the Daily Mail or any other British paper could have been taken in by this unique similarity.
Roger5 1 | 1,458
4 Sep 2014  #16
I can't believe you're having a serious discussion about possible elephant meat consumption in Poland

Magda, you know PF better than to think that. Anyway, it kept Borat off the subject of a pan-Slavic commonwealth for a while.
johnny reb 17 | 3,615
4 Sep 2014  #17
And today the milk shakes that you buy at Micky D's are made from lard or slonina.
You won't find any real ice cream in them.
Can't imagine consuming a milk shake made from an elephant.


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