Return PolishForums LIVE   /   Archives [3]
  PolishForums Archive :
Archives - 2010-2019 / Law  % width 8

Confirming (or denying) Polish citizenship? My paternal grandfather was Polish.

26 Apr 2016 /  #1

I am a bit unsure if I am in the correct section here, but I do hope for some advice.
I was born in 1993 as Italian citizen in Germany (my mother was Italian) and became Italian-German dual citizen later in 1993 through naturalization. The arrangements for this case between Italy and Germany apparently made it possible for me to keep my Italian citizenship.

However, here's where the difficulty starts. My long deceased paternal grandfather (born 1920, died 1979) was Polish and came to germany in 1941 as forced laborer. After the war, he staid and founded a family, and as permanently remaining Displaced Person gained the 'title' of homeless foreigner ("Heimatloser Ausländer"). Whether my grandfather's polish citizenship was actually taken away or just recognized as unusable (East-West-conflict), I don't know. No one lives anymore who I could ask. That same "status" was passed on to my father in 1955 instead of his mother's German citizenship.

Now, later in 1993 after my birth, my married parents and I were all naturalized German on the same day. Lately I've been wondering if I may have an actual Polish citizenship no one has known of. I feel connected to Poland and my interest in the country and our origins have been increasing. Does the bloodline carry it, in this case - or did I even lose it? Despite my felt growing connection, I do not speak Polish yet.

Before I get worked on the paperwork for the citizenship recognition process, is my specific "history" maybe already a big No for citizenship (or indicates a Yes)? Because obviously, I probably wouldnt go through the work if there can only come back a No. My consulate sadly couldn't help me more than refer me to the citizenship process, and they cant offer any further help, apparently.

Also I was wondering if there is a translation out there of the form to use for polish citizenship confirmation. My Polish is far from good enough to understand all questions. This is the form:

I will have to find someone to translate my replies into correct Polish after that - but it would be nice if I could correctly read all questions and try to collect all necessary data first.

Thanks for reading this and for any replies, in advance.
27 Apr 2016 /  #2
Thanks for reading this and for any replies, in advance.

Interesting case, actually. Do you know when your father obtained German citizenship?
OP Parnek  
27 Apr 2016 /  #3
Hello delphiandomine,

yes, my father obtained German citizenship in 1993, on the same day as my mother and I (I have a naturalization certificate on my name) did. It was a couple of weeks after my birth. The big question mark I have at this point is what happened to my grandfather's citizenship (not really something I could just "look up") and how that might affect a possible citizenship for me.

27 Apr 2016 /  #4
If your father is still alive, it would be best for him to claim Polish citizenship first. once he has his claim to citizenship confirmed, your claim will be simple.
OP Parnek  
27 Apr 2016 /  #5
Hello Harry,

I've been thinking about that too, as it sounds like a logical first step and much easier. My father is alive and I talked to him about the entire thing before. He doesn't really seem convinced to go forward with it for himself, at least not at this point. This is why I then thought I may do it first, and if he wants to do it then too, I could help him with it with my experience. But he does not seem very interested to get his citizenship recognized right now.



I'm sorry if this is a bit off topic, but I am still working on my request to confirm my citizenship. I'm making progress.

However, I need a phrase on the request explained in this context.

In context of data of a person, what does "Uzywane nazwiska wraz z data zmiany" mean? I understand it is something like "used name with date of change"? But.. what is it? Do they mean, for married people, what name they decided to go by? I don't really think so because other data fields already cover this (1., 2. and the marriage information). So is it for when people decide to change their legal name for whatever reason (except marriage, that should be explained with the last name and birth name, 1. and 2.)?

Here is what it looks like on the form:

Thanks a lot.

Greetings, Parnek
30 Apr 2016 /  #6
'Uzywane nazwiska' could mean anyone being adopted, using different surnames by virtue of name change through a deed, changing a name say from 'Myslowski ' to 'Myslak' - anything that could identify you. Many people changed their name just after the war to prevent them being recognized.
OP Parnek  
30 Apr 2016 /  #7
Hello terri,

thank you a lot for your explanation. This makes a lot of sense!

1 May 2016 /  #8
Hello everyone,

thought I'd keep any readers in the loop and I also registered, since I have decided to really go forward with this.
Might be useful for people going down this road later on.
Now, as to the evidence I am going to send in, do you think this is a sufficient chain of evidence?

-Polish birth certificate of my grandfather, who I want to derive my citizenship from, in 1920
-Yet to be obtained Polish document proving his citizenship. I am on it via the national archives. Hoping to be able to obtain some voter registration (Election 1938?) or residence records, or similar. If I'm not able to find it, I'll have to go for supplementary indications and hope they will run with it or initiate further research for the case after I hand it in

-("international" multilingual) German birth certificate of my father, in 1955.
-("international" multilingual) German own birth certificate, in 1993
- Certified copy of my German ID (my regional embassy/consulate listed this and my own birth certificate required)

Do you think they will also need
- My polish grandfather & german grandmother's marriage certificate from sometime in the early 1950s? (I'd have to find out where and when, and obtain it)

- My parents' marriage certificate from the 1980s? I don't think so though (polish dad would pass on citizenship anyway, would he not? And the parentage is already proven with birth records), and I think that would be a bit of a pain as they married in Denmark and I'd have to research how to get an international marriage certificate from there.

- Translated German naturalization records of myself and maybe my father? However, I don't feel like this is relevant? This happened two months after my birth and should not change anything if I understood the laws correctly.

I mean, I can always send in further documents if they request it, but of course I'd be good if I gave them all necessary docs right away. ;)

Anyway, thanks for reading and I'm always glad for suggestions / input. Currently on it to find someone to receive my post within Poland, as this is sadly required for a few years now (what a strange rule).


PS. I hope it is ok to make an off topic question like this, but would anyone be willing to proof-read/correct some "biographies" about myself, parents, and grandparents (in sum, 7)?

I tried to puzzle it together with my rather limited language skill and internet research. Bound to have errors though, so I'd appreciate it.

Hi everyone,

just wanted to keep you informed, if you're interested, that I sent my documents and application to my consulate yesterday. It all worked out with the translation and finding a post recipient / service agent. If anyone here is ever searching, the law office of Krzysztof Banek offers post recipient services as well as handling entire cases: polish-citizenship.

Also, besides the 11-pages-forms, I added birth certificates from me, my father and my grandfather (who I derive citizenship from, I got a polish birth certificate for him). Also, my parents' and grandparents' birth certificates are among the documents I sent in, too. After advice from my consulate, I was able to simply use 'international' (CIEC) multi-language birth certificates from the german civil registry offices.

I'll keep you updated what else they may request, and how they'll decide

Archives - 2010-2019 / Law / Confirming (or denying) Polish citizenship? My paternal grandfather was Polish.Archived