Poland 2007 Elections: PO Won, PIS second

These elections in Poland showed one thing - the Polish society is still far from being a wise society. Polish voters are still too easily manipulated by the media and populistic slogans. Instead of the conent, they still buy the package.

Compared these Polish elections to the last US presidential elections one can see what I mean. Even though most Americans (including Republicans) thought going to war in Iraq was a crucial mistake, they still voted for Bush re-election. They did so because they knew it was still a better and less-costly choice to allow him to complete this mission than to stop it and let the billions of dollars go down the drain. The American society understood that once the foundations of the house (a big mission) has been built, the most reasonable way is to complete the job, not to withdraw. Poles decided to throw the baby out with water without looking at possible consequences.

Now the PO officials will look around to set up best cozy positions, will do their private deals, and start building their small foundations while they can and the old, important jobs are still not completed. Millions of tax-payers Zlotys will be wasted again.

And I am happy for them to use my not inconsiderable tax. They will use it to relieve my tax burden. At the moment some of my staff buy new cars while I couldn't possibly replace my 10 year old banger. I am too busy on all the stupid bureacracy - or working for the state to pay ZUS when I am too busty to work for the state and am contributing in other ways through being an employer.

And what old important jobs do you refer to?


Can't agree. I have contributed hundreds of thousands of Zlotys to the Polish exchequer and I don't have the vote.
And before anybody starts, I live here and love the country and people have have no wish to take citizenship. That is an American nationalist idea and proves nothing.

I am British and I voye there. Poles should also have the right to self determination, no matter where they are in the world


I am new as of yesterday Hello but you do talk some absolute ******** I have to say. The huge majority of people cannot afford to fly home on a whim as you would have it - unless they are doctors or dentists of course.

You are painting a picture of Britain as a utopia. Have you ever slept on the street? Stop giving people the wrong idea!

BTW - I am a teacher. I happen to know a far number of gay teachers as it happens. Every single one of them is every bit as dedicated and good at their jobs as their "normal" counterparts, and generally more so.

The Kaczynskis were the laughing stock and the real point is that the ousted one obviously hated gays for a reason.....
Quite abnormal and the poor chap needs to get off to America for psychiatric help.

True. My Polish flatmate gets one trip back a year.

To stay on topic, he claims to have absolutely no interest in the election results.
I was more interested than he was and I'm not even Polish. I just care about the whole world.
Having said that, he's not a fan of the twins.

Speaking to two Polish girls and a Polish woman today, and they didn't even know the results. One looked slightly interested for a moment, then said it didn't really matter, they were 'all the same' to her.


Saint.

Disgraceful - they should be reminded of their families' sacrifices since the war - unless they were party members of course :((

As I checked two-way flight from London to Warsaw is 100 pounds. Two-way flight from Chicago to Warsaw is 400 pounds (and Poles in the US on avarage make less per hour than in the UK).

===

The point is clear. Here are the groups of people in Poland who will find their lives better after PO win:

1. Business people and companies (that will supposedly take less time for bureaucracy when setting up a company).

2. Foreigners living in Poland - less bureaucracy to arrange their matters. More respect and consideration for EU laws, easier and quicker way of doing business for them.

What about the rest (80% of the Polish society)? The fact they will stay less in lines to arrange an official matter in Poland will not get them better or more-paid jobs.

I know young and educated people are usually very optimistic and if you ask them, most of them would tell you they want to be entrepreneurs and have their own companies. But where is the reality? Out of 1000 people one will have a successful company; the others either will fail or will prefer to work for 500 Euros a month. But the majority of those who were optimistic enough to claim they will have their own companies... will end up immigrating to the UK (or stay there) to work for better money as a contractor or cleaner. That's the fact and I see how these young and optimistic people may feel sorry in the future.

I agree that Polish salaries are a scandal - but that is what the market will stand. I asked a "friend" a few years ago why he didn't pay production staff the minimum wage and he said he would, but as they would happily work for less, his directors wouldn't let him pay more than he needed to.

Appalling, and people are only just rightly realising the value of their worth.

Also cant fly home on a whim because of work commitments and they have to rota holiday time that is not just beneficial to them but to the companies and other work colleagues - cant just fly to Poland in one day and back again for shift Mondays


Oh if only it was .... lol

She is about right on this. They don't deserve a vote.


Ask politicians why they grab about 70% of our wages every each month.


PO is just a myth that will be exposed soon (again). But your defense of PiS has no sense, they are bunch of ignorants with no clue how to run the country. They steal less than PO but they cause a lot of opportunities to corruption to other people because of their incompetence.

Exact.
There is one main paper telling them all how to think, how to vote, what to read, what to buy ... may also how to f**** .

So they do.

Make your minds up you guys. Is it the newspapers. Radio Maryja or the debates.

Or was it a judgement based on actually living here in the past few years.

oh yes and in the uk and usa we vote for packagless politicians...

Media outlets indeed have enormous influence on the results of democratic elections. Please note that except of PSL (a specific, archaic farmer party) all those who reached parliament were backed by some mainstream media.

This is true that for example TVN did attacked PiS before even they really started to govern. Ugly TV program called "Szklo Kontaktowe" is a prime example of anti-PiS propaganda. This is pathetic when I see mostly pretty stupid people (I mean TV viewers who call to this program) laughing at the stupidity of PiS and their voters.

However PiS hijacked shamelessly public media, put their own people on all the posts and they did their job marginalizing other parties. Affair with program "FORUM" and Joanna Lichocka (everything is on You Tube) speaks for itself. Still I'm 99% sure that PO will soon replace PiS propagandists on their own. One could only dream about this "liberal" party privatize such cake like public media! (especially without swindles)

My conclusion is that those who are not backed by some mainstream media has no chance and often voters are not aware that they exist at all.

This is because of NI contributions in Poland!

election - tables were turned... the power of murdoch -labour govt and the sun

looks like their plan backfired..

They partly succeed, look at LPR and SO.

Polonia in USA 67% voted on PiS

Polonia in UK 62% voted on PO

It is very interesting, both sides vote because they care, they have their expiriecne. They have their vision of Poland and both sides have good intentions.

i think that says it all really

I've just heard PO representative to say they will not hurry the anti-nuclear shield negotiations with the US (since US seems not to be in a hurry either). This is what I like actually. It's a shame the US government still doesn't treat Poland as a worthy partner since they still require visas for Polish citizens to enter the US.

If PO, through their negotiations with the US, will make the US government to cancel that visa requirement for Poles, I would vote for PO next time.

please be aware that this has been more up to the USA than Poland. I didnt expect PiS to pull it off anymore than I expect PO to pull it off. I know some feel strongly about the issue but some (like me) could really care less. Soon the dollar will be so weak that the US will be desperate for ANYONE to go there to shop so they can boost the economy and then they will let Poles and many other nationalities enter without visas...it will be the natural outcome of a sagging US economy not a result of some high-level talks between our leaders and theirs...

And what do PO intend to do about this ridiculous system where the hard-working are held to ransom and forced to work for the state to reduce their business NI contributions?

I seem to remember that consecutive governments from the SLD onwards have promised to do something about this socialist policy of milking small businesses dry.

fair point,, money makes the world spin,, in uk one core factor allowing eastern europe migrants was the economic boost and thansk we have achieved it,, in the uk the convenience market as develped, the no frills market and thanks to us poles the house prices have had a boost..

Oh Poles, Poles!!!!! What are you doing!!!!! Why you didnt vote for Kachinskiys? You deprive us from this key-ally in our european and world policy!!! I am in deep mourning!!!!

heheh I feel irony, but you Russinas in my opinion are in trouble. PiS and Kaczynski was so easy to play with them. It was sa easy to put them into stereotype of peiople whos directions comes from fear and phobies. Now we have more sophisticated players. It is enought to look on PO candidate on Foreigin affairs misnister. Radosław Sikorski ...

Radosław "Radek" Sikorski

Sikorski was much involved in the Solidarity unrest in the late 1970s, and chaired the student strike committee in Bydgoszcz in March 1981. Stranded in Britain when martial law was declared in his homeland in December 1981, he studied Philosophy, Politics, and Economics at Pembroke College, University of Oxford. While at Oxford he was a member of the infamous all-male dining society The Bullingdon Club, whose members included the leader of the British Conservative Party David Cameron. He then worked as a freelance journalist. In 1984, he took British citizenship. In the mid-1980s, Sikorski worked as a war correspondent in Afghanistan and Angola. For a photograph taken in Afghanistan he won the World Press Photo prize in 1988. From 1990 he was an advisor to Rupert Murdoch on investments in Poland.

Returning to Poland, in 1992 he briefly became deputy defence minister in the Jan Olszewski government. From 1998 to 2001 he served as deputy minister of foreign affairs in the Jerzy Buzek government. During the latter appointment, Sikorski became notorious in the Polish expatriate community.

From 2002 to 2005 he was a resident fellow of the American Enterprise Institute in Washington, D.C. and executive director of the New Atlantic Initiative.

He will cooperate with ... Bartoszewski



Władysław Bartoszewski (IPA: [vwa'dɨswaf bartɔ'ʃɛfskʲi]; born February 19, 1922 in Warsaw) - Polish politician, social activist, professor of history, journalist, writer, Auschwitz concentration camp inmate, soldier of Armia Krajowa (Polish resistance organization during the World War II), Polish underground activist, participant of the Warsaw Uprising, twice nominated for the Minister of Foreign Affairs, chevalier of the Order of the White Eagle, honorary citizen of Israel.

So we are going to have proffesional Foregin policy.

Absolutely no any sign of irony, I am pretty serious. I will try to explain my assertion that PIS is our most devoted ally. Let's see.

Poland under PIS behaved as a mad cowboy in the even rows of efiminated europeans. By Poland's actions all talk about joint policy toward Russia were impossible (PRO and so on).

Moreover, we need there hostility toward Turkey as a member of EU. This position changes Turkish perception of EU, making it more reactionary and clerical. These facts in their turn influence on the perception of Turkey by TransCaucasia republics making them to rush in our tight embrace. Adding everything else, the offended and revanchistic Turkey will strike on Kurds, disorder all American plans over this region. So America like an energized man will dingle on two wires Iraq and Afganistan and will be totally inactivated.

As to Ukrane, by interference in Ukranian domestic affairs, Poland is teared up this country on two equal parts East and West. As a result, East Ukraine with Russophilic preferences will be Russian, but West Ukraine, whose inhabitants equally hate Russian and Poles, never will be Polish.

Exactly what i though Lukasz, thanks for telling him ;)

Show me any historic patterns, when rich nation could take world? Romans? But they were poor fellowas in comparison with Greeks or Carthago! May be Mongols? But they were only a small branch of nomad tribes. To tale a world you must have only two things, burning desire and courage!

weapons help. Why do you want to take over the world anyway - bits of it are in a right state.

British and French Emires are abselutely another things, all of them were Sea Empires, and it is impossible to hold Sea Empire significantly long period of time!

And Poland was blind by its religios false superstitions, we are different


All states have their time limits. Such limits has Poland, and has Russia of course. What do yo think, what our issues will say about Poland? "...there was such brave nation, Poles". And what they will say about Russia? "GOSH!!!"