News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]

Hey it's not like anyone forced you to read it, we had an exchange going, that's what happens. But yeah, it can be tough to follow these online debates so you do have my condolences.

HOWEVER, 1)look at the thread title. 2)compare what you 've written to the topic. 3)See a match?

Maybe you could start your own thread and let this one die as it's run its' course.

Regarding your post:
that's all fine and dandy but without any proof those are baseless accusations and i could just as easily have written that the second i saw the same videos you have.


yet it seems as though what you just posted is a simplified collective regurgitation of a "lantern society" video. Again, those things you've written may be correct but at least hit us up with a link to your source. Otherwise you end up being dismissed and you only discredit your cause.

start this on another thread and you may get more bites;)

USA, Canada / Why aren't Polish people immigrating to Canada instead of the UK? [148]

it's true some uk accents can be quite stately (and some not as i'm sure you can attest to as well) but there is a je nais ce quois about you folk and i think it begins with a "c."

oh yeah that's right baby it's all about culture.

however poles don't need visas to enter the great white north.

....and in case you haven't been reading the other threads you may be surprised to find out the only thing polish women are attracted to are black guys. so says pf wisdom.

USA, Canada / Why aren't Polish people immigrating to Canada instead of the UK? [148]

uhh, Franek, hate to break this to you but i'm not living in Canada, i'm living in Poland. However i was born and raised there and know a thing or to about the place so umm... yeah, deal with it.

if you'd bothered to read what i had written and compared it to what everyone else had written you'd see that i was just trying to dispell a lot of the canadian myths clouding the day to day reality of living in Canada (did i mention the min. 6 months of snow?)

As miranda alluded to, please go and work on your reading comprehension.

p.s. thanks for the defense in my abscence miranda and for being much more diplomatic than my first response would have been- you're all class. i was at a training camp up north in the middle of nowhere.

UK, Ireland / Foreign drivers in the UK escape speeding fines [39]

so shouldn't you be taking this up with the legislators and law enforcement in the u.k. instead of a forum dedicated to all things polish? i mean what's the aim for posting that info here? if anything it'd encourage people to not pay if they don't have to.

i'm against excessive speeding but again if it were foreigners causing accidents getting off the hook i'd say you have a great point. unless that is the case, you don't imho.

UK, Ireland / Foreign drivers in the UK escape speeding fines [39]

i'd be more inclined to sympathize if there were an abundance of foreign drivers causing accidents and not getting caught. you think u.k. drivers don't get off in other countries for the same reasons you listed?

USA, Canada / Roads and Driving rules in Poland versus America [63]

when i went to north america last year i tried some polish driving there. needless to say i brought many close to heartattacks for what would be considered normal here. also needless to say i smartened up pretty damn quickly and realized a driver has to take into account other drivers on the road and their ability to react. try telling that to someone here who thinks it's ok to go over 180 km/hr because they're a good driver, it's like they can't fathom the idea that the faster they go, the less time everyone else has to react.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]

ahh i just got back from the farm so i will deal with your other points later but if they are as off as this one then i pity your analysis.


Please show me how frequently i do this (i guess i got lazy a few times). go on. and when you try to do count also the number of times i refer to country+people or country+leaders or country+military.

when you do that you can see your statement is baseless.

i'll deal with the rest at my leisure.

adieu

Get a drink, have a soda or a fizzy drink maybe even a coffee this has a major frat warning attached to it and if you make it through this then you have my condolences and admiration.

Now despite this (and there were more) explicit statement and explanation you have attempted to dispute this with an "I know you are but what am I?" type response:


Below is a response I had made exemplifying how I stress it is the expressed foreign policy coming from the u.s. government that I oppose:


However you still appear confused on the matter for reasons I can only guess at.

Now let us look at some of your next quote, made in response to my last quoted comment above:


Whoa! Stop the presses here, let's review our source some and perhaps you'll understand how perplexed I am at the line you continue to toe here. I had written this long before your above response:


Ok? Is the position I'm arguing from clear now? I don't wish to repeat myself anymore on this matter and the onus is on you to make the necessary adjustment.

But now I want to examine your full response, dissect it and see if you've made any headway in your position.


Hmmm, dare I say it's quite the selective memory you're displaying here in bold. Please keep in mind it's the existence of one more American military base abroad that I oppose. Let's go back a little bit and see what you and I both had to say before in our previous sparring matches:


I then wrote that American leaders are guilty of the exact same thing you vilify Iranians for (yes you failed to make the distinction between the leader and the people and referred to them all as a nation).


Well according to you that doesn't really matter when Americans do that though:


So looking back at your latest reply, I am amazed at the double standards you've attempted to apply and at the inconsistency your arguments have. By your very logic, Poles, if they had felt threatened (due to misinterpretation) can dismiss the ramblings of the Iranian leader as just that. You yourself have stated that it's fine to dismiss such threats as politicians are not military experts therefore it's does not serve any purpose to bring this up anymore. ok?

But, it is not an issue which Poles should be concerned with by logic of your own arguments; these threats you speak of, despite being baseless are something for people of the middle east to concern themselves with. Your interpretation of the Iranian leaders words, and in my opinion a misinterpretation, were not made towards Poles or the Republic of Poland so it doesn't matter.

The base we are speaking about becomes a threat when it has the potential to become a target or simply create friction when there was none previously. I have stated this ad nausea and grow weary of your inability to acknowledge this one of the key points I've made.

Next:


No I never said americans created Israel so that's a rather off the mark reply. I did claim that the American government has funded Israel for many many years though. If you can dispute that then go for it.


Well you find me a brit who prefers Redman Select over Redman chew and really wishes had stocked up on more Wintergreen snuff ok? But I do enjoy the ales of the isle so maybe something rubbed off, who knows? This is all besides the point.

The point being that it is the American military which is currently over involved in middle eastern and European affairs. Now you go and bring up the past but then follow it with this little gem:


Well I don't know about "bad" but my propensity to bring up the past certainly is relevent. Let's look as to the relevancy of my "accusations:"



Gee why would I have written those things? What relevance did they have? Found it!
This was what you had written:


Well it looks like many are guilty of the same thing but it's interesting to see where it all started. I'd say considering the climate in the M.E. and how it might affect Europe those are very relevant remarks and I would like to add I whole-heartedly agree with you in that British and French involvement in the M.E. also needs to be critically analyzed.

But what's your point? That we should ignore that latest American intervention and look only to European intervention?


No i believe my statement you've responded to states exactly what kind of people are "rootin tootin" chicken hawkes (you know like that little guy on looney tunes).

Whoa, here it is. Please reread:


You've probably found by now I'm simply reposting old comments and this is due mainly to your inability on this debate to acknowledge my (and quite often your own) remarks or refusal to keep them in mind when responding.


hmm I'd say that everything isn't as black and white as you're proposing and I'd be bloody angry at anyone who suggests we turn a blind eye to the precedents history has to show us. I'd also say what I've written before:



Next,


Let's see what you've chosen to base your opinion on, comments such as these perhaps?


No it appears you are the one unable to make the distinction here and my posts more than back up my position. Please give it a rest on this matter as I've given you more than ample reason to have a different opinion.


actually it proves sweet fcuk all as firstly I've never denied I am suspicious of American foreign policy and secondly your own comments attest to the very thing you accuse me of:


paranoid much?


paranoid very much?


nope. you're the one who's full of mistrust by admission of your own statements.
My reasons for opposing this shield have been grounded, observe:


ok well i'm not british (still enjoying the same pinch of cope I'd dipped when I started this longass reply thank you very much) although i was on the underground during the 7/7 events and while i don't want to get into that on this matter i do find your mocking tone inappropriate at best with regards to the situation in the u.k. it's like your actually happy their rights are being overrun just cause the same is happening to u.s. citizens. thanks for showing your colours on that one johnp.


nice cover let's take a closer look though shall we?



It looks like that wasn't the point I was trying to make at all and and actually asked for clarification. Guess you forgot, go figure.

Hmm you don't know where u.s. missles are pointed but seem to speak with authority on where the missles of other nations are pointed? Well now I am confused cause just a while ago you claimed you are low on the intelligence scale (in terms of security, i imagine you have top secret and that's about it) and didn't make any decisions with u.s. policy let alone the strategic policies' of other militaries:



Well sir I owe you an apology on this point. I mistakenly thought you had supported striking Iranian nuclear facilities, where many civilians work. I did not attribute the correct comments to the correct user. My bad.



no that was your proposition so again the burden is on you to provide some rationale for that notion.

Argh! That was a ridiculous marathon of going through old messages. Please be more consistent in the future as it's really unfair for you to make such accusations and blanket statements that I've either dispelled or simply don't match to your previous arguments.

adieu

UK, Ireland / Polish parents hang themselves at their Lincoln, UK home [66]

i'm sorry but i don't feel any compassion for the guy in that video. my only sympathy is for society in that he has procreated and has offspring in this world. perhaps if i knew more about the whole thing i'd feel differently but as i see it, that is just a dumbass thing to do and just puts his burden onto the spanish people.

Life / What do foreigners think about Poles and Polish society (MA thesis)? [14]

I just made an observation not too long ago, it's only one man's observations so i wouldn't consider it empiracle by any standards, nor would i say it's exclusive to Poles. However you did ask an honest question so i will reciprocate.

Poles hate (or at least seem to) following rules of any kind.

Take the following: throwing garbage away, parking; queuing in a shop; traffic laws; city bylaws (dog owners, i mean you here); or simply using pavement pathways, Poles, in my observations seem to regularly do contrary to: whatever has been planned; what is supposed convention; the law; or what has been organized.

I honestly feel it's a competitive thing. I think poles are just really competitive to the point that, somewhat regularly, many people here always believe they have a better way of doing everything, or at best, just see whatever the rules may be as inefficient, at worst, there is a widespread assumption that rules and consequences don't apply to whomever decides to readjust the rules that day. That being said, to assume it's completely a case of one or the other is ridiculous. I could make a few more guesses but then i'd be making complete guesses into others' thought processes.

here's something of an anecdote for you:
a few years back, i observed children from germany, france, and belgium play football- nice little game, good organization. I watched children of the same age and socio economic class (that being upper) from poland, russia and ukraine do the same thing- completely different, very,very competitive and with far more infighting visible.

take the three little kittens i am babysitting here, what ever they shouldn't be doing is exactly what they're doing (i just caught the little black one on the stove top-his little bum is sore now but it's nothing compared to the burns he could have received due to his little expedition), it must be because they're polish kittens right?

News / Absolutely balanced vision of Russo-Polish affairs (in Russian) [39]


check and mate.

dariusz has confronted the correct in a dark alley and skinned it alive to make matching boots and belt.

Life / Do not experiment with Polish medicine if you don't know what it is. [16]


thanks. where were you and your sage advice 5 years ago when i could've used it...along with all the other goodies i plugged into my system. oh the humanity.

Travel / Most Amazing places in Poland. What does it for you? [90]


it's beautiful for sure but not one of the best places to ski in europe imho.
but ok, i'll defer to the spirit of the thread and cease with my blasphemy:(

Travel / Most Amazing places in Poland. What does it for you? [90]


??? zakopane???? i'm no aficianado but you might want to re-evaluate that one.

I'm a big wrocław fan, i love the Beskidy area, mazury is also lovely . i really need to go north more often.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]

i'm listening to it now hairball. compelling stuff, i wonder what all these pro-american foreign policy supporters have to say regarding this information.

USA, Canada / Why aren't Polish people immigrating to Canada instead of the UK? [148]

i've spent more than a few years in various parts of canada and the first thing i thought of when i started reading the posts here was "oh give me a break."

if you've never lived in canada then don't beleive all the b.s. about how great a place it is to live and work.

Every body is waxing about the natural beauty but nobody's mentioning the go ahead the government has given mining companies to dump in lakes, or how the industrial mining and foresting is slowly but surely destroying the beauty the place once had.

You will also find that you can't just go wandering off into the forests. First of all it's really unsafe to go dashing into some random forest, secondly is that it's absurd (trust me if you've lived there then you'd know what i mean), thirdly is that most people live quite removed from mother nature and fourthly you may well end up trespassing. When most people experience nature in canada it is usually on the beaten path which is often covered in cement with wheelchair access and is full of all the kinds of people who like to wear heavy duty hiking gear while walking on a paved path.

when i went camping in the mountains i came across only a few canadians who actually went camping with a tent, (not out of a truck or rv or trailer) to areas with no running water (except from the waterfalls), where there were no lights at night except the moon and stars.

But forget about that because a canadian winter is about the roughest thing you can find this side of siberia, look for a minimum 6 months of snow on average. you will experience -30 temperatures in most of the country.

The people are quite boring and the cities are just plain ugly and every house looks the same. In fact i swear it is the crap design of the cities that makes the people so dreadfully dull. (think stucko strip malls with big car parks/parking lots) Look up "strip mall" on google images to see what fills canadian cities.

If you don't plan on owning a car then getting around in many (not all but many) cities is a nightmare and if you do own a car then be prepared to drive at an ever shifting but always very low speed limit. if you do speed then you will get caught and get caught often.

Canada has almost as much state control as communist cuba (no joke in fact the province of SK ranks just behind cuba regarding government control) and you can't say what you think too loudly or some fat arsed hr. cubicle queen will try to make an example of you, or worse yet there will be a "commission" to investigate.

commissions are popular in canada, it's the number one tool used by the government to convince the public they're doing something about a problem when really they're just doing damage control.

Canadians by and large are just like americans except they feel the need to scream as loud as possible about how humble they are.

oh yeah check out how many people the rcmp, opp and municipal police forces have killed with tasers in the last year or two, it's higher than 30 now i think. Oh and check out how the police pland provocateurs amongst protestors in order to give them an excuse to beat them in Montebello QU.

it can be a nice place but it's got nothing on the u.s. u.k. or poland or most of europe for that matter.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]

that is rather interesting re: L. Strauss.

I am not disputing the claims made in the video regarding u.s. spending as that is a pretty easy factoid to come by. You must admit though, many people who don't want to acknowledge something that forces them to reassess their political compass often dismiss things out of hand. Perhaps a quick screen shot of the various conflicts the american military has been engaged in since korea could have added to the overall effect.

ahh but it's easy for me to criticize rather than do a better job isn't it? shame on me.

I think we are on the same page regarding this issue but i hope you know what i meant.

adieu

one thing to note hairball, is that u.s. military support of iraq, although it certainly was there, seems to have been overestimated as far as some percentages indicate.

it's been some time since i've read anything with actual numbers showing who was supplying the iraqies with what but i recall a smaller american contribution than most claim. Maybe you can find some info or insight i didn't find though.

I'm not saying they weren't involved in steering events there but the paper trail isn't as obvious as most think it to be.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]

interesting video but those are allegations that required evidence put forth within the video. As there isn't it's all too easty to just label it as sensationalist. i may share the sentiments of the video's makers but cannot condone thier approach.

Why the cross imagery behind the accused political leaders? there were various themes presented in the imagery that i have a distaste for, just like major network reporting and presentations attempt to convey subliminal messages, so too does this video.

Again although i may share the sentiments they had the perfect vehicle to at least post something to substantiate some of their factual claims and this opportunity was not taken.

take a look at some of the reporting done by John Pilger or some of the evidence provided by Micheal Ruppert; they provide very concrete and factual findings.

Life / Applying for EU passport... [51]


uhh i never made those statements. i think you've done the same thing i do from time to time and select the quote function on another member's post.

my own experiences (by proxy) do support your statements though.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]


actually when you speak of a country as an entity this represents a failure to do so.


Hey what's with this response? Look you made the claim and i simply called you on it. You don't get to label it nasty just because it's true. Now you claim that iran (please clarify if you mean a leader or the people or what) has always been a threat so please address my the questions posed? And it's not me that should feel threatened but the people who stand to become the target of aggressive u.s. foreign policy.


Spare me such drivel and i am disappointed that you'd waste my time with such a response. You show me where i'm off the mark or drop the insinuations. But frankly i grow tired of root'n toot'n folks like yourself who are simply unable or unwilling to entertain the notion that their government and military could do any wrong in the world and can't imagine themselves involved in anything wrong.

If you are a soldier then you have sworn to defend your constitution from its' enemies, just as soldiers have before you. If this is the case then please kindly inform me how people in Iraq, Iran, Afghanistahn (prior to the russian invasion), Cuba, Guatamala, Korea, Vietnam (not to mention American support for Pinochet against the people of Chile and Suharto against the people of Indonesia) have been enemies of your constitution.

If you cannot do so then I would like to further my argument that in fact it has been american activities in the last 50 years or more that should not only be called into question but have been the cause of untold deaths the world over and future american iinternational intervention ought to be viewed accordingly.

You claim terrorists and corrupt governments abroad yet turn a blind eye to the same claims made against the u.s. military and it's government by millions of people for a very long time. What makes you the good guys? the fact you wear uniforms? what makes your leaders so free from corruption? the fact they wear suits?

But i don't blame american people, you guys have been and are being lied to habitually by your leaders.


So work on your reading comprehension as i explicitly deconstructed that notion a long time ago and you're either unable to make a distinction or purposely trying to play the accused.


Cry me a river. Show me the prejudice and stop trying to drag this into anything personal. I'm not accusing the american people of anything except being misled and if a person can't ascertain this then this represents a failure to comprehend basic english.


Again, work on your reading comprehension. I don't view states as entities which can be readily personified and consider it a simple minded exercise which only serves to confuse people.

I could pose that question back to you but substitute a different country and would you give your own leaders a free pass or not?

I do not give russian leaders the benefit of the doubt. In fact i am powerless to do absolutely anything to affect matters internationaly. i only challenge your double standards in that it's no surprise russian leaders act in their self-interest as american leaders do likewise. I think the leaders of both countries are scum but that is besides the point.

In fact you make the claim russian leaders have missles pointed at europe. Do i think they should be pointed at europe? Hell no.
But if we assume this to be true then let's look at possible outcomes ok?
What would they gain by instigating a war?
If they already have missles pointed at europe and are ready to fire, then what good would building an interceptor base be now?
And if russians or iranians were really hell bent on blowing up parts of europe then do you think they'd do it out in the open or covertly?

What would either groups have to gain by doing so in the first place?

You made the arguement against iranians:


I called you on the hypocrisy in that there is more than enough crime within your own borders that you lot should concern yourselves with first. and you come back with this?


That's not even an argument, mine was a reply, in this case one that put you very much on the defensive. This is a prime occassion for you to admit how good a point it is or at least admit your initial reasoning was faulty from the beginning.


And that's why i don't support intervention abroad until internal matters can be fixed.


Well things in america are getting closer and closer to that reality.


like weapons of mass destruction? support of dictators? support of terrorist organizations? go on take your pick, or shall i provide you with a wider selection?

But again what comes across is your complete failure to grasp the notion that (in fact i've had a genuine like for many americans i've met but also a dislike for many too, like people from poland, czech rep, hungary, canada, australia and the uk) a mistrust of what your leaders choose to do regarding foreign intervention must be seperated from american citizens.

It's the policies which come out of your country which many people have a distaste for but so many of you guys can't seem to make the distinction between yourselves and anything with the american label attached to it.

Try it and you'll see that so many people from around the world are on to something.


Ok you give your own a free pass but want to see iranian civilians suffer for what their leader may or may not have said. Double standard.


Ah you had left those last four letters out last time. Nonetheless- it's ok for your military to be pointing missles where ever because they're old? But everyone should be afraid of the iranian military cause of something we're told they could do?


Actually looking at a simple map of the occupied territory over the last couple decades shows this rather clearly. Go to the amnesty international site for some numbers and estimates of civillain killings and measures used in that country. And don't present me with such euphamisms as "heavy handed" when ruthless suffices just fine.


Really? The information has not exactly been kept secret. Check again.
Now, should you apply that same approach to that of iranian affairs you'll at least be on you're on your way to a balanced one.


and yet you immediately followed it with this...


I'm afraid i've all but lost hope in your objectivity.

I see you are struggling in this debate so have attempted to make it appear as though i don't like americans or something to that affect. Maybe you're hoping someone will pick up on this and rally to your defence, maybe it's just projecting, i really don't know. Anyway if you can't come up with good arguments then fine but at least be honest about it.

This debate has strayed from the original topic. So i'd like to stear it back on track.

I feel that the missle base just wouldn't be effective should another nations leaders decide to target a given location in europe, that's my main attack on this thing. if you can explain how it would deal with covert attacks or land attacks or large scale missle attacks then i'm all ears. But until then i say it's not rational to assume the iranian military a threat to polish security and if russian leaders wanted to blow the joint up then they would do it, base or no base.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]


let us not confuse americans with american policy makers. every country has good and bad elements.
unlike most people, i do not regard nations as entities which i can personify. i try very hard to make sure i include it is the policy makers and their initiatives that i speak for or against please keep this in mind should i fail to include some key words. Your last reply fails to acknowledge this.

I find it odd that you would vilify the Iranian people based on limited information regarding their leader when the rest of the world could adopt those same standards and apply them to your elected leader or hopefuls or their advisors.

secondly please give me the kind courtesy i reserved for you in not attacking you personally. I’m sure you’re a nice guy and had been quite civil in this debate but feel you were stooping a bit on your last response i.e. the position you argued in your last reply is riddled with ad homonyms that i will address throughout.


a threat to what exactly?

and what is this that it has always been one? since when, the beginning of time? or since american policy makers decided to take an interest in the affairs of iran? i don't recall iran overthrowing the u.s. government and establishing a puppet leader only to have him ran out of town and then forever more being labelled the bad guy by any Iranian administration, the same cannot be said vice versa.

unless you can offer some specifics i will give you the courtesy of trying my best to ignore that statement.


Yet you speak with such authority on the true purpose and intent of american leaders trying to establish bases beyond her borders:


While I don’t claim that the base would be used offencively, I do find it amusing that on this point, despite you being low (your admission) on the totem pole, you on this point have authority to say what the future use or strategy of your government’s plan is.

Do you see the double standard you're attaching to your arguements here?

Now here is your response to my interpretation of your comments. An interpretation i determined you are suggesting iran could suddenly become a threat to european nations, a claim which i deem delusional as it would result in the end of the Iranian nation as it exists now:


ok let us take another look at a small sample of what you wrote in your last and most recently:


and most recently this:


No it would appear you indeed are making these assertions and i have in fact interpreted your comments quite well. And I don’t see how anything short of foreign operatives acting under the guise of Iranians would attempt something that suicidal, something akin to what the nazi’s did as a pretext to invade Poland.


ahh so it's ok if the u.s. takes control of foreign oil but should russian leaders make up their own minds how to handle their reserves then that's the time to point guns at them and do some sabre rattling? That's not a good strategy no matter how you look at it.

More to the point, there are many other ways of getting bombs into a country that do not require missiles, this shield couldn't hope to cope with those so it's not even useful from a security perspective. If i wanted to wreak havoc with a nuclear device in another country I'd make damn sure it wouldn't be traceable to the country i am from as i would be well aware of the international consequences.

It's not in the interest of the people of Poland to have anything but harmonious relations with her neighbours and their allies, you see there is no need to for weapons among friends. Friendship takes longer to build, i'll admit that but the american way has lead to increased global conflict which in turn makes the whole process take that much longer.


well that was riddled with allegations and no source. you may be right but allegations aren't worth a lick without confirmation and evidence.

I will agree that it is doubtful that many of today's leaders got where they are through honest means. However that supposition applies to the leaders of your nation and mine just as well and doesn't even begin to touch what corruption goes on once leaders find themselves in power the world over.


ah well then that's ok if your leaders start pointing old missles at whomever they choose because.....? And when was the last carrier built? any under construction? battle ships? how about recent refitting or new equipment on those? And where are they? surely nowhere near the over 700 bases abroad that american leaders have established?

And what of the missles currently outside the US, where are those? A quick internet search reveals that in fact the american military has built missiles since the cold war. I am not accusing you of lying but i am not sure what you meant as it seems quite clear your statement is not true at all or you’re implying all recent missiles are deployed abroad- something which is easy view with suspicion and mistrust. please explain what you meant.


ok so tell me what exactly i'm so ignorant of. anyone can claim your posts display ignorance of both recent history and the entire history leading up to the state of affairs middle eastern countries find themselves in. Right now Poland doesn't have aggressive neighbours on two fronts and is a member of nato so i do not see how the current situation within this part of the world mirrors anything in recent past so i am assuming you must be referring to a different part of the world.


that is a misinterpretation on your part i'm afraid. In fact it has been your assertion that europeans should worry about iranian missles and you hinted at russian as well. I sincerely doubt there is any threat unless it is by way of some intervention behind the scenes coming from u.s. interests in seeing a destabilized europe and or an increasingly destabilized middle east. These are not allegations mind you, just my intuition and i don't encourage anyone to take my intuition at anything beyond that.


Funny, i was thinking the same as regards your position on iran and russia:)


Well I have seen those interpretations and am not sure I agree with them in terms of accuracy of the quotes I have listened to. the media seemed to have twisted his comments to fit whatever agenda it is they may have. But I’ll assume you’ve come across some quotes I haven’t read or heard. Regardless of that, the same can be said for american and israeli leaders, it's just that it appears the events that instigated most of what we now have before us has come from american and israeli leaders.

And regardless of that, I couldn’t give a rat’s *** if the guy wants to send a pack mule or a missle into Israel, it’s not an issue for Polish people to deal with so the point you presented is moot.


and you have american leaders or agencies sponsoring attacks and assasinations within middle eastern, asian, central american and south american countries. There was american involvement in afghanistan before there was russian and there was american involvement in the middle east way back in the 50's.

You could look to just some of that for american resentment in the area or you could just fall back on the dumbass soccer mom argument of "they hate us for our freedoms."


yet there are countless instances of rape, murder, molestation, kidnapping and torture amongst americans. I cannot imagine what would make one choose to stone another to death due to a religious law but then again I can't imagine what goes on in the mind of many criminals within your borders either.

In the end i'd say it's better to focus on the problems within your own household before you try to dictate what goes on in another household, in this case an autonomous, democratically elected one.


and somehow amidst this there are elected jewish officials in the iranian parliament?

Besides how can you ignore the fact u.s. leaders have sponsored iraeli forces both financially and militarily while those forces systematically terminate palestinians. they displace or kill civillians with seemingly little regard if those victims are men, women or children. Don't you think this might have something to do with the resentment their religious brothers and sisters have for what america stands for in their reality? Oh wait israelis have lighter skin and wear uniforms and your government sponsors them, so that means it can't be the source of discontent or wrong beyond words.

You can also look at a plethora of comments made by american political representatives or their families (i suppose they might be in the know) regarding attacks and portraying them as evil, more to the point the american military actually possesses the capacity to deliver on these threats.


ok this is a childish attempt at an argument and we both know it. as we both know i have no sway in these matters and nor do gentlemen such as myself. Nonetheless while you can only speculate what might be if rationale souls such as myself were to ever prevail we have ample evidence that your approach is the approach which has failed the world many times over.


not at all and don't present me with such a foolish statement as it debases our whole conversation. It's the position of double standards and failure to see any fault from your leaders and the interventionist strategy often touted by many westerners that i abhor.

I mean come on, here you are defending the righteousness of the decisions coming from an administration which accounts for (and has been doing so for quite some time) roughly 50% of military spending globally and has well over 700 bases overseas and has been involved in more conflicts abroad than any other nation since ww2 and still manage to criticize and characterize someone who views that with suspicion? It’s preposterous.

I don’t think Iranians should be putting their resources towards increased weaponry but I don’t feel their neighbours should either, so if you support their neighbours having nuclear capabilities then what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. I don’t feel Polish leaders should be putting any funds towards continued armament as it wouldn’t make a difference anyhow in the grand scheme of a global conflict.

In the end i do feel this base will be built though.


Well i was never suggesting that. I support citizens having the right and freedom to arm themselves. I wrote about illegal firearms i believe you misunderstood what i meant so i'll leave you to come to the correct conclusion.


and on that i am in complete agreement with you but feel that when one cannot trust their elected officials to act without corruption at home then it is a given that they must not be trusted to act without corruption abroad.

Life / Applying for EU passport... [51]

^ why do my good friend and his mother both have two passports then?

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]

"Supposedly?" i rest my case


well then stop pretending that other nations shouldn't take positions which are beneficial to them first and foremost. and this idea is beneficial to america first, not as an afterthought but first and foremost it was meant to further the american geopolitical policy (which i'll admit probably does not serve in the average american citizen's best interests).

Regarding your reply:
you seem to be assuming a lot on behalf of the iranians and assuming their intentions and as typical patriot you don't assume them to be honest or peaceful or at least no more so than those of your own leaders. i find that to be entirely dishonest.

You don't seem to be suggesting there is anything wrong with the fact that although u.s. missles can reach anyone and anyplace on the planet americans by and large get downright angry and feel "threatened" if one of those targets should ever gain the ability to reach back. I find that position to be not only dishonest but cowardly as well.

You seem to be suggesting that despite the republic of poland enjoying the friendliest relations it's had with it's neighbors in a very long time and increased prosperity that there is some need to suddenly start arming itself against iran of all nations. I find that position to be dishonest.

You seem to be suggesting that iran might suddenly morph into the threat americans paint it to be and start randomly attacking any country for no apparant reason and not expect to be completely invaded/overrun or worse within less than 10 days. I find that to be not only a dishonest representation of reality but completely delusional as well.

The only threat that i really feel could come out of iran is if some intelligence perchances upon a traitor willing to do something that gives the right and mighty west a pretext or dire need to take action against this "rogue state" you can take that one to the bank;)


I will not only reject the analogy but i will propose that on a global scale it is in fact the u.s. which plays the role of both landlord and gangster in your story. it is funny though how people seem to be getting along alright until americans show up with their pistols and bullet proof vests.

better investment for u.s. citizens would be if you all dealt with the number of illegal firearms on your own streets, who you're all letting in to your country, where you're sending your young men and women, which companies and which people are making the most gains off u.s. led colonialism. But i suppose that would force americans to actually take a look in the mirror as a nation with the lights on and your leaders don't really seem eager to have that happen.

we seem to be coming at this from completely opposite ends. i have a difficult time viewing american foreign policy with anything but mistrust and suspicion (for reasons mentioned above).

I also find it funny in a sad and telling way that all the "bad guys" the u.s. leaders seem to target in terms of actual force used against have been or will be at such incredibly poor positions economically, politically and militarily (and also want to do something as outrageous as control their own money supply) by comparison that i'm at a complete loss how so many u.s. citizens still manage to conjure up the themes and patriotism they do when it is abundantly clear that the u.s.a. is indeed the primary villain under its' current and past administrations. when you people really do become world leaders it'll be when you show the rest of us how to overthrow corrupt politicians, don't make haste.

on this primary difference of opinion based on actual real world observation i find it unlikely that i will find merit in any extension of american powers abroad which you seem to laude as noble yet i see as insideous, capiche?

end rant.

UK, Ireland / Polish parents hang themselves at their Lincoln, UK home [66]

i can't judge these two as i've never been either of them but i have to wonder about what caused them to make this decision.

i don't think killing oneself is inherently wrong, i mean if it's one person's life then they can do whatever they want to with it, including ending it if they see fit. but they had someone who really really needed them and one can only guess how their deaths and how it happened will affect her and those she in turn affects. that's the sad part.

News / America: Take your missile base and shove it! [116]


notice the first word of your next? talk about disinformation...



Better question is why should the u.s. policy makers care enough to try and put this base in poland hmmm? you seem like a good guy john p. but the notion that u.s. interests aren't first and foremost behind american initiatives is laughable imho and i wonder if you simply choose not to acknowledge this or simply choose to beleive something to the contrary.


no one's threatening anybody, russian leaders aren't thrilled with such a close american prescense, i can't believe this comes as a shock to you. if russia put up some missles in canada do you think american leaders would just shut up about it? or maybe cuba;)


American foreign policy is the one actively keeping the american military extended far beyond your country's borders i'd say look to your own as far that accusation is concerned. and please, break free from this time capsule mentality, russian leaders are in no hurry to try and gobble up an eu state, the idea is just silly.

News / Poland Rejects US Missile Shield (talks will continue...) [80]

great news, but i hope his "negotiations are continuing" is a euphamism for "that's the end of it"

I think if Poland pays for it then it gives a foreign power that much less influence in Polish affairs. If the U.S. were to pay for it then that would be a much worse case scenario imho.

News / Why are foreigners coming to Poland and from which countries? [119]

i think idw made a good observation on page one.
as a side note, i wonder what the mathematical calculation would be for factoring idw's attempts to bring race into this as a general predictor of social incompetence due to a complex on his part, any takers?

UK, Ireland / Polish workers found hung in Herefordshire [51]

may they find something better if there is anything after this life.
hopefully their families will get to the bottom of this, one can only hope this effects some positive change somewhere down the line.

USA, Canada / POLISH AMERICANS AND THE 2008 US ELECTION [79]

since Brzezinski is way high up in the Obama camp i'd say it's almost a certainty that some genuinely shady stuff is around the corner involving most every aspect of Obama's future presidency, unless Hillary actually let something slip about an assassination.

Life / Opening a savings accounts in a Polish bank [27]

do not choose bank ING, their rates are terrible imho.

Love / Pornographic Polish magazines [65]

this picture dials in on what's going on with the brains of their target "readers." Males aged 16-28 will respond, to varying degrees, with their wallets to that kind of thing.

The thread starter is the one who seems to be viewing women as a commodity here. Just because she feels strongly about how and where the human body is to be viewed, that doesn't mean that the models featured necessarily feel this way.


Funny stuff:)