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Damning archives of cleansing in communist Poland


Seanus 15 | 19,672  
31 Jan 2009 /  #1
I'd like to know the opinion of Poles on the following:

youtube.com/watch?v=4wJpkCyD0Zw&feature=channel, this video is mostly in Polish with English subtitles. There is some English commentary. It's a 24-min video.

I find it insincere to attack the likes of Krawczyk and Wałęsa, levelled by those who didn't understand the prevailing climate well enough.

Still, if Wałęsa has nothing to hide, there is no harm in trawling the archives.
hairball 20 | 313  
1 Feb 2009 /  #2
levelled by those who didn't understand the prevailing climate well enough.

On the contrary, I think they were well aware.

It's a good thing for Poland, that most Poles were smart enough to see that the duck brothers were playing dirty games. By discrediting people in influential places, they could have slipped thier own cronies in through the back door, so to speak.

All the Poles that I have asked are quite aware that most the information collected by the secret Police is at best dubious.
OP Seanus 15 | 19,672  
1 Feb 2009 /  #3
If you are talking about the Kaczyński brothers, then yes, they were aware for sure. They are the chief protagonists.

However, I'm talking about the wave of people who jumped on the bandwagon of blame, those that didn't live in that era. They didn't realise just how potent and dangerous a force the communist secret police were.

It is easy for those to point the finger at wrongdoings but we must fully understand the environment at that time. Ask yourself this, why did it take so long to shake off the scourge of communism?
Prince 15 | 590  
1 Feb 2009 /  #4
Now this two guys after NWO are going to debate polish politics :)
hairball 20 | 313  
1 Feb 2009 /  #5
why did it take so long to shake off the scourge of communism?

Because the People in power like to have control. And if the 'commies' were good at anything. It was controlling people. So the powers that be can keep that tight control on us and call it 'cleansing'.

The speach he (kaczyński) made in the film stank of the Church's influence.

What 'cleansing' would have been next? Ethnic?
OP Seanus 15 | 19,672  
1 Feb 2009 /  #6
You are more than welcome to enlighten us, Prince. We're all ears :)

The resident Poles are very much invited to set the record straight. This is what we expect when us 'amateurs' are so wrong.

Exactly, hairball. It was all about control and in such an iron grip was created. I've heard stories from different older people here in Poland. Wałęsa had it much harder than people thought. He successfully defended himself several times and would clear his name one more time for the record books.
hairball 20 | 313  
1 Feb 2009 /  #7
this two guys

We both live and work in Poland. So why not?
celinski 31 | 1,258  
2 Feb 2009 /  #8
Well worth reading in full.

Ethnic Cleansing and Soviet Crimes Against Humanity
by Ataullah Bogdan Kopanski

During the period from 1939 to 1949, the Soviets committed mass murders of many peoples. Among those holocausted were: Baltic, Slavic, Caucasian and Turkic people, eastern Germans, and Poles.

vip.latnet.lv/LPRA/ethnic_cleansing.htm

Harry  
2 Feb 2009 /  #9
Well worth reading in full.

Ethnic Cleansing and Soviet Crimes Against Humanity
by Ataullah Bogdan Kopanski

Carol:
a) That link has nothing at all to do with the topic of this thread.
b) The author is a well-known nutter who just makes shit up as he pleases.
c) The piece is riddled with errors (just one example: what he saids about Finnish prisoners of war).
d) You really do need to get over your unhealthy obsession.
Grzegorz_ 51 | 6,148  
2 Feb 2009 /  #10
Damning archives of cleansing in communist Poland

What... ?
celinski 31 | 1,258  
2 Feb 2009 /  #11
That link has nothing at all to do with the topic of this thread.

Harry,

I thought you could read?
Prince 15 | 590  
2 Feb 2009 /  #12
We both live and work in Poland. So why not?

Well I support opening of all archives. Everybody knows that you can find a lot of lies there but it is the best solution.

Wildstein case was very interesting

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronisław_Wildstein
Sokrates 8 | 3,345  
2 Feb 2009 /  #13
IPN needs to be liquidated as its a political tool and archives opened to the public, all of them.
sjam 2 | 541  
20 Feb 2009 /  #14
doomedsoldiers.com

The Doomed Soldiers Polish Underground Soldiers 1944-1963 - The Untold Story

Wrong thread I know.
celinski 31 | 1,258  
21 Feb 2009 /  #15
The Doomed Soldiers Polish Underground Soldiers 1944-1963

Thank you great site, I wish they had a side like this starting around 1939.
ela_lawyer 5 | 64  
21 Feb 2009 /  #16
In Europe's notorious side of history, Communism, Nazism, and Facism have long been a thorn in its side. All three movements resulted in countless deaths, supression, deportations, and war. Former communists should be prosecuted and treated the same way as Nazi war criminals are, no exceptions.

Too many historians with roots to communism focus only on the Nazi Germany portion of WWII and not surprisingly tend to ignore the often harsher side of Communist rule.

The IPN is an organization that should proceed further with its investigations and documentation of crimes against the Polish nation. It isn't currently a political tool of anyone.

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